No Limitations/ Marlene Rose

When Marlene Rose https://marlenerose.com/ discovered molten glass, she was energized by the adrenaline rush of the material. While pursuing her BFA, she learned that glass could be used for more than just craft, but as a means to convey an idea of what she wanted to say. Although glassblowing was more common at the time, she was drawn to an ancient technique of sand casting, typically used for metal. Sculpting molten glass in a mold of sand sent her in a direction where everything was new and exciting with no limitations.

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Transcript

[Music]
0:11
welcome to the independent artist podcast sponsored by the National Association of Independent Artists also
0:18
sponsored by zapplication I'm will Armstrong and I'm a mixed media artist I'm Douglas sigworth glass blower join
0:25
our conversations with professional working artists hey welcome back to the
0:31
podcast Douglas you've made record time coming back from art in the high desert and in your big travels West how are you
0:38
sir I'm I'm tired man it was like we got our way out there after several shows we
0:45
worked our way all the way to practically to the West Coast and then when we turned around to come home and
0:50
realize how far away we were that was a long one it was three solid days in the van that's brutal that's a lot of time
0:57
in the van that's a lot of time together and then you guys are going to jump right back into the studio together too
1:04
do you ever does that does that how's that work out for the sigworth glass it would be fine if it wasn't going to be
1:09
like a million degrees this weekend so so it's going to be a little bit of a of a tough weekend trying to get stuff made
1:16
to fill in the holes to to get off to St Louis which is the next one sure I'm a couple hours north of you and I'm
1:23
dealing with 97 on it's about 94 tomorrow and 97 on Sunday and it doesn't let up for the rest of of the week until
1:31
really we we start to go down there and and and what the streets of St Louis are going to feel nice and cool at a at a a
1:37
nice chili 889 that it's looking like it's going to be next weekend but oh my gosh yeah I I
1:44
don't know how to do it I I'm I'm looking for a little advice here because I am in a a metal box with no AC and a
1:53
the flies have gotten bad again how do you what do you guys do as far as like I know you guys are fighting the Heat e
2:00
constantly with your furnace but what do you just stay up all night we go to bed early early to bed and early to rise so
2:06
we try and get up at like what's early um six what six we go to yeah before the
2:12
sun goes down yeah MH so that we can be up at 3 during these hot spells dur you
2:17
know especially at the end of summer here we have to we have to do that I can't do it I'm G to do um I you know I
2:24
I'm a parent you're a parent we know how it is to feel terrible so I'm just going to feel terrible I'm going to go um I'm
2:32
going to I'm probably going to get up at 3 but I will do the wolf thing and just
2:37
take some some naps I'll work until like two and then I'll take a nap I don't know figure it out maybe I just won't
2:43
work yeah I don't like my work right now I'm deep in the self-loathing phase so
2:49
um I don't know we all go through that but I'm I'm dealing with that so I'll break out of it somehow but man it's
2:55
it's some tough times out in the studio right now it's hard when it's like the elements are fighting against you and
3:02
you got to get through that I mean when it's crunch time you kind of want to be able to just it would be nice if things
3:08
just started happening really like smoothly and and exactly the way you want them but there's always these like
3:13
stumbling blocks right yeah I've got a neighbor right now I had to I had to Caren out on her and tell her to stop
3:21
burning green wood right next to my studio like a tree fell or something no no she a live tree like a live tree you
3:29
know not aged sitting upright she is trying to burn it down chainsaw didn't
3:35
work or doesn't have a chainsaw uh so I went over and yelled at her and um I
3:42
yeah I did I did some yelling I your arm strong in way uhhuh yeah I got a little
3:51
uh yeah I got a little red with her um okay so anyway it's time to move back to
3:57
Santa Fe there you go it's time to leave yeah oh man had enough summer hey have
4:02
you ever done this this is something that never happened to me before on the way home uh from out west but uh Rene is
4:09
driving and I'm thinking we've got about another hour in us so I am on my phone
4:14
and I'm looking for a hotel an hour away from us yeah I booked it
4:20
non-refundable even like a holiday and express was like 189 or something crazy
4:25
like that yeah they're gouging right now right it's awful totally so I book it feel good about it and then I hit the
4:32
maps to to drive to it and I realize I have booked the hotel an hour behind
4:38
me no and not an hour ahead of me horrible we've all checked into hotels
4:44
at six or 8 o'clock at night and the hotel clerk isn't answering the phone it's just ringing off the hook so I
4:51
couldn't call and get them to refund my non-refundable night but anyway it worked out we ended up getting our our
4:57
money back and booked something for further up but that was an interesting uh experience on the road yeah I've done
5:05
I've I've booked um wrong weekends for sure I I've done typically I've done
5:10
that uh that one-of aind show in Chicago and I booked the wrong weekend and by the time I went around to booking it it
5:16
was like yeah sorry everything is like $300 a night it's not going to not going
5:22
to work out for you so damn yeah I mean we've all done dumb things I've never
5:27
done this I was trying to remember who who told me this but um I can't it's such a bonehead move I don't want to
5:33
name them by name I am remembering who it was but uh they they went they showed
5:39
up at Winter Park a week early oh there was like it was one of those years where it was like there was a week between
5:44
Gasparilla and then there's an off week and then there's winter park and they just drove they stayed all week and went
5:50
over to Winter Park and they're like how come nothing's here mapped out on the
5:56
street yet that's everybody when are they going to close the streets well they're going to close them next weekend
6:02
smart guy that's one of those that's definitely an art fair nightmare showing up early or late alcohol is a hell of a
6:10
drug all right well speaking of other art fair nightmares have you ever had an
6:17
artfare nightmare that you get locked into the art fair and you can't get out I've gotten locked out in my nightmares
6:24
where I'm like I can see the show going on and I can't get my thing through and I got to walk it through like a I don't
6:29
know Dolly through a restaurant or a mall um but no I've never gotten locked in well that happened at a show that the
6:36
show we were just at at Art in the high desert Chris dolquist and and Kyle dolquist they were volunteering on as
6:44
board members to laying out the show the first night you know before the artists show up yeah but then they could stay
6:50
and set up their own booth well everyone had left who was on the board the head
6:56
of the show came by and said I'm gonna be be sure you're out by this time because it's going to get locked well
7:02
they didn't realize he's the one who's actually locking it so when they went to the gate to leave they can't get out oh
7:09
and this Fairgrounds is huge so they're like walking the whole perimeter hoping they can find an area to get through
7:14
find a weak spot yeah yeah so leave it to say that these two ended up scaling
7:19
the fence to get out no way yes they scaled the fence there's there's no way
7:26
that David beom doesn't have that on video somewhere there's some that he and Carla are sitting back
7:32
watching and laughing but no that's there's there are no Kinder people than than Chris and Kyle daas so absolutely
7:38
I'm sorry that happened to those guys but that's hilarious we are laughing with you Chris and Kyle with you not at
7:44
you doglas was laughing at that's that was really rude Douglas I know that's
7:50
amazing so uh you brought up art in the high desert any anything else you'd like to share and it's been several years
7:56
since that that show has has happened the the board of directors and and David
8:01
did a great job putting it all together uh crowds were good they were they were
8:07
carefully curated so to speak you know what I mean so people who came were buyers you know I find that in a lot of
8:13
kind of resort towns you know these Resort Town shows that that that happen sometimes whether it's like Jackson or
8:20
even Sun Valley where the attendance is are not necessarily all of that so I don't know that the attendance is is
8:27
there at that kind of show to for everybody to have a big weekend but um
8:32
it's worth it the audience is well healed enough that there are you know those big fish just just swimming around
8:39
you know sharks infest the waters we did have a couple of those big fish sales so it worked out for us so I'm really
8:46
grateful that they did that they brought it back from the dead they sure did and I have a lot of faith that it's at a good footing that it's going to have a
8:52
future so I I'm really happy about all that plenty to plenty to grow on there and absolutely so there's this one other
9:00
story I wanted to tell about the show that we might get a kick out of so you know how everybody has been having
9:05
trouble with their Vans lately it seems like it's been kind of a theme it seems like a a pandemic of Van issues for sure
9:12
definitely so uh good friend Anthony Hansen guest from last season pulls into
9:18
the show turns off his van goes back to turn it on later to start his van and it
9:23
won't start oh jeez so when he came to realize after uh of phone calls to
9:30
mechanics and all that that he uh when he pulled into his parking spot he was
9:35
at a slight angle and he actually was just out of gas what a rookie move Come
9:42
on Anthony that's amazing po bastard so he
9:48
happened to win an award on Sunday and so in his in his award speech he said to
9:53
everybody if you ever break down first step that everyone should do is to make sure you check and see if you got enough
9:59
gas on the tank all right Anthony keep gas in your tank uh all the rest of you I don't know if you've ever run into
10:05
that problem I do push it to the Limit from time to time I was driving um quick stories I got stuck there is a gas
10:12
station gosh on the way to back to Santa Fe and you cut across like you're
10:18
driving like uh good three hours without a gas station and you're going through
10:23
the middle of the desert and the first gas station you hit if you have to stop there mhm it's going to charge you like
10:30
650 a gallon so I've come close but um basically just eating eating Pride for
10:37
not filling up before I hit that three-hour stretch but I've never we never pulled an Anthony uh so don't pull
10:43
an Anthony out there we've got a new uh new catchphrase here buddy I'm sorry we're gonna have to do that to you hold
10:49
Anthony yeah yeah hey uh the good people is application asked us to talk about something this week Douglas you got the
10:55
email there what do you what do they uh what what do they have here for us sure a lot of us have gotten that email about
11:02
a survey so zap wants to put out a survey so that they can know you know
11:08
what they can do better what our experience is As Art Festival artists just so they can you know improve their
11:14
services and you know hear our point of view exactly they're always growing they're always changing the product that
11:20
they are offering to shows as well as to us the survey is going to help them know what to focus on in the future and
11:26
provide insight into what it's like to be uh one of us at festivals and art fairs so it should not take you too long about
11:34
5 minutes to complete and they have a carrot they got a little carrot for us I need a carrot what's the carrot the
11:40
carrot is um by taking the survey we are entered in for a drawing for a $50 Visa
11:46
gift card so ah all right so we got the $50 Visa gift card is something but to
11:52
be honest it's just more important to try to have your say well you know what
11:57
uh they had me at tell me what you think all right all right that's true they're really hoping to get a good response
12:03
rate this year so that they can share some insights with the whole community on the state of things it's going to be
12:08
open for another two to three weeks so if you're able uh to get into zap and um
12:14
you know fill it out I will drop the URL into the episode notes so you can just
12:21
uh open up the episode notes and click on the link it'll take you directly to the survey all right so the let's get
12:27
right into it my friend you have a great talk coming up let's let you set it up
12:32
here it's a a monster in our industry and a an incredible uh glass artist this week that's true she's had a very big
12:39
presence that I have I've admired over the years so I'm glad I've had the chance to sit down and kind of pick her
12:44
brain and find out what it's like being her so marinaa Rose Marena Rose is our
12:50
guest today sandcast sculptor glass artist from Clear Water
12:55
Florida this episode of The Independent artist podcast is brought to you by zap the digital application service where
13:02
artists and art festivals connect well sometimes I'm in a real hurry and I just love that I have things that are saved
13:08
in zap to streamline my process to that end Douglas one of my tricks with zap is
13:14
to favorite all of the shows that I'm even remotely considering that way I can
13:19
filter them all and then look at all the deadlines at once but then there's other times when I have a little more time on
13:25
my hands and I'm looking into other shows and I want to get to know about the show and all the information is
13:32
right there in the prospectus with links to the website I can see who the artists are that have participated in the past
13:38
you know that's a great idea Douglas because one of the ways that I was finding shows at the very beginning was
13:44
to go online and see who I felt my work looked good with it's just great that
13:49
all that information is organized and easy to look over when planning our next
13:54
show season Mara Rose welcome to the independent artist podcast I'm so happy
14:01
to see you thank you so much for inviting me this is fantastic it was fun seeing you out in Sun Valley we were
14:08
both out there together with that gorgeous weather did you guys get to enjoy some of the mountain time while
14:14
you were out there a little bit not too much we just came in did the show and left but we did have some time okay well
14:22
I know you have two daughters were both daughters there or just one just the one okay the other one is back was back at
14:27
school for preseason in soccer okay so it was a little family time I I saw some of your social media look like you guys
14:33
are all at least having good family time on the road yes definitely we love
14:39
getting out of Florida well speaking of Florida I don't want to ignore the fact that we're recording just a few days
14:46
after the hurricane came through your area so how is everything how are you guys doing well thankfully we live on a
14:53
little bit of a hill the only Hill really in Clear Water so we were fine it
14:59
was minimal we had hardly any wind or rain but I guess the tides just came up
15:06
and so everybody that lives on the water was having some issues that I know of a
15:12
lot of people were flooded is your studio and gallery also
15:17
located where you're talking about up on a hill um it was downtown and every everything was fine mostly everywhere
15:25
was fine other than areas that that are on water so we are not on my gallery nor my
15:31
warehouse nor my house so it's always a bit tense this time of year yeah right
15:37
living so close to where the hurricanes come in living on the edge that's just that's everything that's my
15:44
life there you go well I I think we've been kind of running in the same circles
15:50
here for a number of years and I've always kind of you know looking from the
15:55
outside in towards you I've always perceived this kind of this big presence
16:02
this big kind of operation and does it feel that way from within do you feel
16:08
that way about your own art practice and about what you do well definitely I have help and that
16:18
makes it so it's it's easier to you know be an artist I do have a lot of help I'm
16:25
in many places at the same time so it's really the only way that I can do that
16:31
so I've had help ever since the beginning I realized my uh strengths and
16:37
weaknesses and administration was definitely not one of my strengths so I
16:42
knew that I needed help to be organized and right from the Geto I had somebody
16:47
helping me because both Thomas and myself are not that so I've always had
16:53
the idea of getting help and not doing everything myself even though I say that
17:01
but I'm I am definitely in charge of everything and everything is comes
17:07
through me and I right read every email and I'm involved in in everything so yes
17:15
and no because I'm I still have my hand in everything I think that we do on some
17:22
levels as artists feel that kind of like we we have to come to terms with what we
17:28
can and what we can't do and to be okay with delegating you know obviously not
17:34
in the creative aspect but there's so many other aspects to running an art business that is just like it's
17:41
impossible to do all of it you know to to have your I obviously you oversee all of it but you can't do the accounting
17:48
you can't do the you know what I mean all the all the minutia that keeps the wheel rolling yeah and I think that I guess if
17:56
I were to do everything which I could I'd probably be very small like maybe
18:02
I'd have one Gallery representing me or you know I just I just don't think that
18:07
I would be doing the volume that I'm doing or or that I like to do so I think
18:14
that would be the difference I mean Administration I've learned how to deal with it and I I know how to understand
18:20
it and and do it myself but I think that's probably the key to any business
18:27
is being able to step in and wear the hats as necessary and and know how to do
18:34
everything so that you you can get help well part of that big presence uh that I
18:39
I perceive anyway is you've got your hand in you know the art fairs the inperson events you've got a gallery
18:47
Galleries and then you've got like the store Galleries and then you've got your own Gallery can you talk a little bit
18:53
about you know what you all have out there that showcases is your work yeah
19:00
so I have roughly a dozen galleries who represent me nationally and
19:07
internationally I have yeah I do the art fairs going to be doing art basil
19:13
actually art Miami particularly this this fall and um and then we opened the
19:20
marina Rose Gallery in clearw more just as an office but then I
19:27
decided when I was looking around the space came available that was in downtown Clearwater and this beautiful
19:34
1920s building with brick and I thought wow that this is a really nice place to
19:39
work and and then I thought it would probably help the downtown bring people there to come see me so you know it was
19:46
kind of a win-win situation but yeah we opened that Gallery about nine years ago
19:53
okay nine years wow so I sometimes get that area I mean I think of of the
19:58
greater area like Tampa clear waterer uh St Petersburg and aren't there a number
20:05
of kind of glass hubs in that area like you know you got some chah Huli
20:10
Galleries and Duncan mlen yeah no it's turned into we call it the glass
20:17
Coast yeah there's so much activity happening in in my area uh started with the chahul Museum
20:24
in St Petersburg um and then Duncan mlen and I used to work in the same studio and then
20:31
he went out and started his own thing and that's really been incredible for
20:37
the community and then um the imagin museum happened a few years ago which
20:45
shows the studio glass movement the history of the studio glass movement so most people who know about chahi that's
20:53
who they think of when they think of glass now they have a context of you
20:58
know all the people doing incredible things with with glass from the 60s onward most of the artists being alive
21:06
today so that was exciting I helped the benefactor put that museum there I
21:13
connected her with the collection and I feel like it's probably been my best I
21:21
guess matchmaking that I've ever done because it really has helped so many
21:26
artists and our Community to to understand what's happening right now in
21:32
the studio glass movement that's interesting CU you know not a lot of people know that the studio glass
21:39
movement is fairly recent you know what I mean I mean obviously people think well chah Huli and you know he kind of
21:47
put glass on the map but there were a number of players involved that got us
21:52
to to where we are now do you want to speak a little bit on that yeah that's been one of my big biggest purposes in
21:59
all of this I guess the greater purpose is to educate people on this studio glass movement that is happening right
22:06
now and it's very exciting it's like this explosion of
22:11
creativity with this spectacular medium that's been around forever but mostly seen in um blown work uh throughout
22:20
history and people started experimenting with glass more sculpturally in the' 60s
22:27
with Harvey Littleton being one of the founders of the studio glass movement and he started playing around with glass
22:34
more sculpturally and and then it just started this attention on the material
22:40
as as not only a craft medium but a medium to communicate an idea and so
22:47
when I learned the technique that I do in the 80s the early
22:53
80s I found out later that the technique was new for glass it was um based on an
23:01
ancient metal casting technique that has been around for thousands of years and glass has been around for thousands of
23:07
years and um but the union of doing this technique in glass just happened in in the late 70s early 80s so when I
23:15
realized that that I was doing something that was new and different and pioneering this particular method of of
23:23
working I was like wow what else is going on and then I educ ated myself on
23:29
all the different ways that people since the 60s have been playing around with
23:34
glass as a sculptural medium and I find this to be very exciting because it's
23:41
happening now and most of the artists are still alive and most people like you
23:48
said think of glass and Dale chahul and he put glass as a as a medium to
23:54
communicate an idea on the map but that's all most people know so with this
24:00
Museum it's so educational as to all the different ways that you can work in
24:05
glass and I find it fascinating so when you were first exposed to Glass was it
24:12
glass blowing or was casting always your entry point and what you knew right
24:17
away well what's what's funny is that I was getting my bachelor Fine Arts and I
24:23
couldn't decide what medium I wanted to focus my attention I really love painting and sculpt
24:28
and I avoided the glass Department because it intimidated me first off I
24:34
saw a lot of why is that why did it intimidate I just thought it was so physical and dangerous and you know you
24:42
know traditionally is a is male dominated and I just thought well I
24:47
don't know how strong I am and I don't know if it's it's for me because I I never was interested in in throwing pots
24:55
and Ceramics I was always interested in the sculpture side of it so glass to me equals glass blowing so that that never
25:02
interested me to take the class but then eventually I said okay it's the only class that I haven't taken all right so
25:10
I decided to try it and what was funny was the professor Jean C who is still
25:18
there I think it's his last year and he taught the class very much um from the
25:25
idea of sculpture he was he had a a Ceramics background
25:31
and so he was got interested in glass too because of the experimental nature of all these new ways that people were
25:38
working in glass sculpturally so his approach was very unusual at the time in
25:44
the early 80s his approach was more sculptural but he did start with glass
25:50
blowing he taught it for a few days and then he gave just as much time to all
25:57
the other techniques that he knew about one of them being the sand casting which he had
26:04
just started playing with he heard about people experimenting in Sweden with it
26:10
so he went to the levy he grabbed some sand and he started playing with it and
26:15
that's when I learned it so very very new and he was just like figuring it out
26:22
and and that's kind of an interesting environment because it's like anything goes everyone's kind of you're learning
26:28
as you go and getting excited about oh how this happened or that happened and it's a truly inspirational moment
26:36
completely and that's what I find interesting is when you don't know anything you have no limitations yeah so
26:43
it was interesting like just one example of just what you're saying I had no real
26:48
I was not a scientific person or I didn't have a real you know background in chemistry and physics and so you know
26:56
I didn't really think about any anything other than I have this idea and I want to do it so I we went a lot to
27:04
scrapyards he loved going to scrapyards and finding cool metal objects and
27:10
incorporating them and in his sculptures and and then I was influenced by that
27:15
and then um since you're in New Orleans there was a lot of um levies and trains
27:20
and I saw these beautiful railroad spikes and I thought wow this is such a gorgeous shape I wonder if I could just
27:27
put that in my my glass and he's like oh there's no way this is solid steel you
27:34
know the compatibilities of the two it'll never work I was like okay well I'll just try it and then maybe I'll get
27:40
a picture out of it right maybe it'll last for a week and then it'll crack and break right but I'll get that
27:47
picture exactly so I did it and for some reason they all came out and they lasted
27:55
and so we tried to figure out why that was and we thought maybe the rust on it was a buffer but stuff like that he was
28:02
shocked you know like there's no way that that should work and it it worked and so there was just a lot of you know
28:10
anything goes like you said I mean I I cast into a submarine door like I we
28:15
just kept ladling and lad and he was like yeah that's that's a great idea and um so I made this piece that was poured
28:22
into a submarine door and then I ended up presenting it in the submarine door but stuff like that you know like I'd
28:28
see a submarine door in the scrapyard and I'd say wow that's a great shape wonder if I could use it as my mold and
28:35
he's like yeah why not try it I mean he was so much like that like just like no
28:40
limitations yeah no limitations he was an incredible Professor still is that's
28:47
cool I mean when glass kind of Hit the universities that time frame' 60s 7s '
28:54
80s 90s and today I guess but it made it except ible it it made it so that we could have the movement you're talking
29:01
about the studio glass movement as it is and as it's as we see it today yeah I feel so fortunate you know cuz some
29:07
people today are like oh you don't need school you can you know it's just not as big of a
29:14
deal going to college it seems like that it was for me and my parents and anyway
29:21
it's just different viewpoints on that but for me it's like if I did not go to school I would not be doing what I'm
29:27
doing today if I was not educated so it's super important to me to be that
29:33
exposure you know having those opportunities that you can you never would have like I never would be a glass
29:41
artist I know that for sure my husband says oh you would have found it but I I really don't think that would have
29:46
happened I would have gone another direction for my my life and it's just interesting how how that one class can
29:54
change your life and and your paths so I'm so appreciative of that I say that a
30:01
lot on the show on the podcast here that you know I've got 20-year-old kids and
30:06
they are trying to figure things out by anticipating which direction they're going to go based on the current
30:12
knowledge that they have and my wife and I are are constantly saying to them you
30:18
don't know what kind of unexpected spark is going to Arise at any given time so
30:23
you need to really follow the things that that interest you that's spark sent you down a road and look at this career
30:30
you have yeah and let me tell you it was not easy I learned the technique and I
30:37
just it it just clicked with every single aspect of my personality from you
30:43
know I love to draw sketch the idea I love sculpting um I was really into sports
30:49
and adrenaline and I I loved you know crazy stuff like I love jumping out of airplanes and speed I I jump horses and
30:58
I just like anything adrenaline so who would have known that this you know like
31:03
I said I was intimidated by for some reason glass blowing and that had
31:09
changed my life but it's funny and you know when I learned it it was
31:15
absolutely it just I knew that this is what I should be doing and I was having real success at school and then in New
31:22
Orleans I went and just went to some Galleries and I asked them what they thought more just of like a critique and
31:29
I got picked up by a just incredible gallery and had a show as a student um I was still in college I was
31:36
a senior we sold everything I had a great write up and I was like okay this is my life and I was like that's it and
31:43
then I graduated college and I was like okay now what I know what I'm doing I
31:49
know what I want to do but where do I do this you and how do you do it I mean and
31:55
how do I do it there was no no no path because you know I couldn't just go
32:01
to a glass blowing studio in the 80s and say I want to you know throw some ladles
32:07
into sand which is super messy I want to take up your cooling ovens for roughly a
32:13
week you don't need them do you no I mean for us our kneeling time we will
32:18
have an oven full of blown glass and it's like a 12-h hour cycle you're a
32:23
kneeling cycle how long you said weeks no it well it can be with the bigger pieces but typically about 100 hours
32:30
which is roughly six days so that would be like it's like my ovens are tied up
32:36
that long and I can't put other work in there to to anneal no no no way so that was so right there was exactly the
32:44
problem I was running into so I was like okay I'll go to graduate school because that's what art students do they they go
32:50
to graduate school okay and so I went to graduate school thinking I'd be able to just make
32:57
work which is really all I wanted to do because I I found what I wanted to do and um and so nothing wrong with
33:04
learning more and I was was happy with that but as a graduate student you know
33:09
I was thinking I was going to make a lot of work but it was a blowing facility that I went to I went to CCA when the
33:18
sculptor had just arrived on the scene so you know change takes a little time so I thought it immediately I'd be able
33:24
to make a ton of work turns out it was once week I was able to make my work and teach the same time so it was kind of a
33:31
waste and so I just decided to leave and
33:37
you know was super frustrated and I didn't know how to follow this path and
33:43
you know it took me almost a decade before I convinced um the studio where
33:48
I'm at now that I was legit I was for real I mean I'm in my early 20s and like
33:54
you said is I'm going to take up your oven you're not going to be able to make your own work when you sand it's going
34:00
to be messy glass blowers don't like that and starting out it's not like a painter you know the the the cost of
34:07
building and having the equipment for your own personal Studio it's almost like the way to get there is to rent
34:16
time from another studio until you have invested enough that you can start building your own equipment or buying
34:22
your own equipment or whatever so you were kind of in that tough period of how do I actually get to the end game of
34:28
being able just to produce my work the way I want that's so right because the studio at least for what I need you
34:35
started like $100,000 to put it together so there's that's prohibitive to anybody
34:41
who's just gotten out of college there's just no way so you have to find a place to rent and I found this gentleman that
34:50
are that I really liked and but he he didn't want me so he he came up with
34:56
some huge figure that he could build me some equipment and so again I was just
35:02
so deflated but I had the number that he said and I started working and doing
35:08
other things and eventually seven years later I saved the money and I said okay
35:13
I'm ready and he he was kind of testing me because he said okay well you can use
35:20
my equipment but we'll put this money towards you renting the studio and that's how we started working together
35:26
but I think he wanted to know that I was serious I wasn't just yeah like like next week you're going to move on to a
35:33
different medium of some kind because this is and I've ruined all his right and I've ruined all of his equipment in
35:39
the meantime and and it's not just taking up that a kneeling oven you glass
35:45
casters you soak through pots of glass like it just like drinking water it's
35:52
just like dumping the glass and you know glass blowers can make our supply last a lot longer but when you're going for
35:58
those Solid cast pieces you go through glass like crazy yeah and one day I will pour
36:05
roughly 400 lbs of glass that's insane a whole Crucible is that is that the whole
36:12
size of your what your uh furnace will hold is 400 lb yeah so it's like about
36:17
350 PBS if we leave like a little layer at the bottom but yeah so it's a lot of
36:23
glass that we go through it's taking up the whole Studio like you're yeah in
36:28
there so there's days where that other person in the studio wouldn't be able to use use it so you have to have a very
36:36
particular type of Studio that a caster and a blower could
36:41
work in which would be large with a lot of cooling ovens and a number of
36:47
furnaces so I eventually found the place and it's been fantastic he's he's been
36:53
so helpful and and it's been a great great partnership I I work you know I've
36:59
been working steadily for the last 20 something years never taking a break you
37:05
know in the Summers we take a break for hurricane season but pretty much every year I work
37:10
from november-ish to May June and sometimes into the summer if I really have a lot of commissions yeah that's a
37:17
that's a common question people ask last people is like you know do you kind of
37:22
produce work in Seasons or periods and like you for the most part we are like
37:29
247 yearr round furnaces running and except for maintenance type stuff but
37:35
yeah we're constantly turning it out you know it's it's a yeah it's a race it
37:41
feels like a race sometimes yeah you can't people say you can't just turn it off when you're done and I said no
37:46
because you'll ruin you'll ruin the the equipment if you turn it on and off usually so it's just running for a year
37:54
two years or when you need to do the maintenance so there's so much energy
38:00
and expense in making the glass pieces a lot of the conversations you know between different art mediums and stuff
38:06
is especially with glass folks it is it's how do we get over that hurdle of
38:11
getting to a place where we can make the work that we want to make you know that
38:17
is such a huge thing Tony cray and I had a a conversation a couple years back in
38:22
his episode you know talking about how he's he built himself the most
38:28
inexpensive framework metal framework um I forget the name of what he called it
38:34
but literally we kind of have to do it in these weird kind of steps you know what I mean until we can kind of arrive
38:41
at the the right kind of space to do what we want to do and then things get a little easier you know a little
38:49
easier maybe maybe maybe that it's like how do we sell it you know all the all
38:55
the other things you have to figure out as an artist but really just getting to the point where you can make the work is its own kind of stumbling block totally
39:02
and I feel like you know people you well they still do they ask is it tough to sell the work is it tough to let go of
39:08
it and I feel like it really is difficult but I think it was more
39:15
difficult when I really didn't have a way to make the work so you kind of hold on to it like this is it but once I
39:22
started you know being able to consistently make the work as much as I needed to then it was easier to let it
39:29
go and know that it was going to a good home and people who really appreciate it see I never had a problem with that
39:35
considering the fact that you know our gas bill electric bill for running these Studios is astronomical I'm like okay
39:41
this is going to pay the bills right totally please go please go please go
39:48
until I can keep the keep this train on its track right oh my gosh totally well
39:53
let me ask you so we find ourselves here kind of in a time in history where gender roles are kind of getting thrown
40:00
out the window for the most part and it's good and it's refreshing but neither you or I grew up in that so did
40:07
you ever find that coming up the ranks working in glass that being a 5 foot
40:14
what three 5 foot2 woman did you ever come across any of the barriers that
40:20
maybe the guys in a in a male dominated field you know might kind of want to
40:26
push aside or or what was that like for you definitely felt that for sure when I
40:33
took the class at two lane and then again you know when I approached the studio where I was where I eventually
40:40
worked is it just from the appearances you know I don't feel like I
40:47
was taken seriously you know I just that's that's what I a feeling you have
40:53
but I think that you know once things started going well and I had some
40:59
success you can try to push somebody down or be negative but you know if you're doing okay you can stand proud
41:06
and just say whatever you found a way around you know
41:11
it made you maybe more resilient um not that it makes it it's hard to be appreciative of the folks who
41:19
maybe put stumbling blocks on our way but it is part of the path you know for a lot of us it's the OB
41:26
that that get us to the other side of what we want to do totally for every difficult situation I feel like you set
41:34
up ways in which you handle those situations and then you're better on the
41:39
other side that you can predict those um moments and then you know how to handle
41:46
it and avoid it or confront it or whatever it is but I do think that that
41:52
that definitely in the 80s I for sure was not taken seriously and I think if I
41:58
can just maybe put a little bit of my own perception or my thoughts on the matter that you know
42:05
perhaps the thought that well if you're a female in this industry that you need
42:11
to do it all you need to go in with the ladle and you need to scoop up that heavy Ladle and dump it into the sand to
42:18
create the form that you've laid out and all that stuff but I'm sure that when those physical limitations come in you
42:24
can realize that the person just scooping the ladle isn't the artist you know they're the they're the muscle but
42:32
the creative is what you're doing and so that is the Forefront of the creation of
42:39
the art and we can let go of those kind of like well do I have to do it all do I
42:47
personally have to have my hands on that ladle for me to be considered the artist
42:52
that's so true and that is something that in the beginning when I was young and a little bit more I guess strong I
43:00
would say I I mean I'm pretty strong now but it's yeah you get smarter and I did
43:05
have that Viewpoint that I needed to do everything and I did do everything like I said from ladling to the welding to
43:15
every single part of it um but then I realized that you know I'm not going to
43:22
make it physically physically right you'll have like a five your career 10year career and your body will be
43:28
burnt out totally I mean one of the assistants in the studio got a hernia from throwing around big ladles and I
43:35
just you know it's it's very physical so it's not that I can't do it and it's not
43:41
that I don't like to just keep my hand in it for fun because it is fun but
43:46
really like you say the artwork is in the molding in the ideas in creating the
43:54
idea so that all happens you know before when I make the mold during when I'm
44:00
making the sand mold and every aspect of it like the pouring I feel like it's just very mechanical it's dumping the
44:10
glass in a hole so to me I would rather preserve my back for the eight hours
44:17
that I'm over a mold you know fiddling and getting it exactly right as opposed
44:24
to the hour and a half that it takes to pour the glass into the mold and put it
44:29
away and you're involved in the pouring in the sense that it at least what I've seen from you know what you have out
44:36
there for videos is you know with torching and directing and cutting with the casting shears you're still in there
44:42
getting hot you're not like come back an hour later and say is it done yet no you're in there doing it you're just not
44:48
the grunt who's carrying those ladles across the studio yeah it would be virtually impossible because of the
44:55
volume like said the 350 lbs that we pour in a day you know if if I'm over
45:00
the mold for 8 hours and then I'm pouring for an hour and a half I'd be dead yeah exactly you know I mean yeah I
45:09
think that it's at a certain point you know I just like to be smart about
45:16
things and make sure that I'm healthy yeah well a lot of us uh who work with
45:22
glass we fall in love with that in IAL kind of like the molten fluid material
45:29
that that's kind of that adrenaline hook that you were talking about but then there is a kind of a different kind of a
45:36
love that we have for when it's finished you know like glass has a kind of a
45:42
magic quality about it in my opinion can you describe that kind of dichotomy
45:48
between the different states what makes it so seductive for you oh that is such
45:54
a good question I think like you said from every single aspect of it I mean
45:59
the adrenaline like you say I think that is definitely attracts the people who work in glass because it's so dangerous
46:08
that you know it definitely lifts you up and it it you know it's like exercise
46:15
when you're in that zone and but when I feel like you you're you could really
46:21
hurt yourself you could die you could be seriously injured um it it really keeps
46:28
you on your toes and something about that I don't know is kind of is
46:35
addictive It's actually an addictive thing that every glass blower glass
46:40
artist will if they hear this they'll know exactly what I'm talking about it's just something that I feel it you feel
46:46
it and and so that's what initially you know well I told you everything about it clicked with this
46:52
technique but that adrenaline portion of it was just so was just addictive and um I love that
47:01
it was a dance I used to dance a lot I love the choreography like you said like
47:07
I am in charge in that studio that's for sure I am the conductor of the orchestra
47:14
in every aspect and every movement that I make they know what I'm talking about they know what I need and so it's it's
47:23
really fun for me I used to love team sports and I love the physicality I love
47:28
the teamwork I said it's beautiful like a dance everybody knows their part you know what I'm saying it is part of the
47:35
big picture of why we love to do it and that in itself the making of is probably
47:41
every artist feels this way is is what what they love to do and and why they do it so but
47:49
then you know envisioning how it's going to look in the end and sometimes times it's exactly
47:57
as you think it is but I think with with glass it's it definitely has a mind of
48:04
its own and things can happen that you you don't predict or you can't predict especially with some of the finishes or
48:10
colors that we work with and incorporating metal or experimentation
48:17
of what you can do with the medium you never quite know what you're going to get I find that thrilling um not knowing
48:25
I mean it's SC on one hand and you're trying something different and you don't know how it's going to end up and that's
48:31
also a thrill well one thing I like about like your technique for example is I'm really familiar with how Renee and I
48:39
work with flow and transparency and and
48:46
smoothness and yet you work with glass in a technique where you get texture and
48:52
weight and there's transparency but it's not as thin it's more translucent and I
49:00
find the the different ways of working with glass just so cool that that you
49:05
can achieve that yes that is interesting because you know I embrace the
49:14
imperfections I embrace things that just happen I like
49:19
the bubbles a glass blower would be like are you crazy um blink with say those were
49:26
holidays the bubbles are holidays oh that's funny I love the
49:35
holidays I love a good holiday but I I love the imperfections and actually when
49:42
you know technically you get good and you get better and better and better and
49:48
sometimes I find the freshness of my earlier work when I wasn't quite as
49:53
technically proficient there's a fluidity that I prefer and I'm now now
49:58
trying sometimes to get back there reintroduce it back in yeah yeah where
50:03
it's just a little bit more out of control controlled out of control and um so that I I really like
50:13
that aspect I since you know it's poured in sand the glass remembers the mold so
50:20
it looks like beach glass or you know it was Unearthed and I like that it looks
50:27
like a relic and that's the reason I chose this way of working those imperfections for me are so different
50:34
than most people who work in glass that that is really exciting for me the solidity like how solid it is you never
50:41
want that in glass blowing you want it thin and our teacher kept telling us can you can you blow it a little thinner
50:48
please right and I'm like you're celebrating the heft you're celebrating that right so it's so opposite
50:55
everything that I do is so opposite and sometimes I feel like you know I so can
51:00
appreciate what glass blowers are doing and the technical proficiency and and
51:06
the creativity it's just utterly different to how I work you know
51:11
like I don't like Perfection and I don't like the way it looks that it's absolutely you know smooth and perfect
51:18
so it's funny we're working the same medium and but yet it's so different it
51:23
is so different I have thought about your work over the years as kind of a
51:29
feeling of like an artifact that would be you know maybe in a dig an archaeological dig or something it's
51:35
like this treasure that was found and part of it is like what you're talking about that the surface that is achieved
51:42
from being poured into a mold in the sand it creates that look or that effect
51:49
yeah that's and that's one of the main reasons why I was so attracted to the technique was I thought it had a finish
51:55
that was utterly unexpected for glass you know it just was so different when I
52:01
first saw it and I just love that it looked like it was an artifact or was
52:06
Unearthed so I I definitely play that up and try to incorporate that aspect in in
52:14
everything that I do I mean some bodies of work are not quite as raw but most of
52:19
them I like that like the horses that you're working on they have a more of a smoothness to them you know and the
52:26
Buddhas and some of the other pieces almost have like a spiritual quality to
52:32
them is that kind of are you kind of going for an in your work an essence of
52:39
that or for sure where does that all come from yeah yeah that's for sure
52:44
everything definitely has that aspect for me the horses are very personal to
52:51
me and important just because they're for me my way way to escape and and
52:57
gives me space I I just got back into it about seven years ago I started riding
53:04
again after about 35 years I did it as a kid and um it was my most favorite thing
53:10
to do but I just never had the time or the way to do it and then my kids showed an interest and so
53:17
I was like oh God don't go up bonding I was like okay if I go up there I don't
53:24
think I'm going to get on so and that's what happened they lost interest which I was um okay with CU it's pretty pricey
53:33
and um but for me gonna say scary like like scary dangerous it is that but you
53:41
know that's my life so um but yeah so that to me and then I just you know I've
53:48
been thinking about my horse what horse am I going to do and they're so personal and to me but um eventually I got one
53:57
out which is what I've been doing recently and it was inspired by cave drawing in France and I thought if I can
54:03
take a line and turn it into a sculpture that would be really cool so yeah those
54:10
are definitely for me very spiritual and then the butterflies too they're for
54:17
sure inspired by my daughters who were interested in anything flying as as
54:24
babies and kids they were just looking at butterflies and birds and you know wow I want to fly too and I just thought
54:31
wow that's such a great symbol of of who you can become and and being better so
54:37
that was of course had to be thrown in the mix and Buddhas are very obvious
54:43
spiritual image that so many people can relate to which is why I chose it it's
54:48
just one of those images that is relatable to everyone so it sounds like
54:56
you you work in imagery that is Meaningful uplifting to to you
55:02
personally but then you know it kind of might have a hook for somebody else too like it might have broad appeal perhaps
55:08
or do you think that way or do you think solely on what resonates with you oh
55:15
that's a question right there I mean I think that what university did for me
55:22
was make me think about what I want to say and what I want to
55:27
communicate and what's important to me and what you know what is it that I want to say without any commercial commercial
55:35
side to it it's just like that's what what's so great about going to college and university is that it's just you get
55:41
in touch with your voice but then you know I
55:47
never quite expected that people would like what I was making during that
55:53
period in college I was like wow really you know I just would get surprised when people wanted the work or
56:01
liked it enough at first I was just giving it away if anybody said they liked it I was like oh my God it's yours
56:08
here you like what I'm doing you know because it's so pure it's just like it's your thing that you're trying to say and
56:16
so then I saw that there was Commercial Appeal so I was surprised very surprised
56:24
and then you know what I have found is that it it has to be something that is very pure as
56:32
far as as what you want to say and what you want to make and then I find people will seem to like it when it
56:40
it's very pure like that like the authenticity behind it coming from a
56:45
real pure place you're saying yes but then at the same time it's hard to not think about the commercial side of it as
56:53
you're trying to pay your rent and like you said run a business support your
56:59
family right we have nothing else you know it's just there's nothing other than the art business so there's nothing
57:04
to fall back on and so I think for me having this business side which I never
57:12
thought I had you know I was always thought artists are just artists right
57:17
they call us starving artist like we don't know how to sell what we do right and it's that you you have that side of
57:23
the brain people say and a lot of artists do like that's that's all they want to do is just create but I what I
57:30
didn't realize is that I actually do have a pretty good business sense I have no idea where it came from and I never
57:38
studied business I never studied marketing I never studied any of that so
57:43
all of this is just sort of trial and era and what I found is that you know
57:51
even in when I went to um The Graduate School I told you and it didn't work out
57:56
I said to myself oh you know it' probably be a good idea to work in a gallery
58:02
because then you would see how the galleries feel and what they're looking
58:07
for and how it works from the business side I'm going to go work in a gallery
58:13
and that was my just my idea when I didn't know what to
58:18
do and it was just like I said it was just like some this this inherent right
58:23
idea and and then I just from there I I
58:29
learned many different things from the business side you know from from how galleries like to work and then it just
58:35
gave me a lot of insight and and I think having this sort of business side is
58:44
that I I could see very quickly when an idea was commercially appealing like oh
58:51
okay I just made that horse and it sold at the first show that I put it out
58:57
in okay and then I start thinking to myself that's good what did I price it
59:03
at okay noted and I write all this down and then I note the color and I think
59:09
about all that like after it's kind of like an after the pure communication
59:16
like you said like that you want to make it for you but then quickly the business
59:22
side of me is looking and analy Ing and thinking okay so there was some
59:27
rightness there what was that or it didn't sell this new idea was it a busy
59:34
show how many people walked by what's the price you know stuff like that so I
59:40
I'm constantly analyzing those things as well so it's kind
59:46
of the executive director in me the marketer like all that stuff comes in at
59:51
a certain point it's all the different hats you wear right it's all the different hats yeah so I'm always
59:58
analyzing and probably overthinking things too much but I think it's it's a
1:00:03
balance that if you you're not good at you have to get help with it or else you
1:00:09
know you'll be the starving artist if no one sees the work then yeah you're just you're G to
1:00:16
be a starving artist but the key is is okay how do we get it seen and sold
1:00:22
getting it in front of people's eyes and observing the reactions because the selling part of it is is a piece right
1:00:30
one part but the conversations and the spark if it if it doesn't generate anything we know okay well that's that's
1:00:38
not working right whatever the price if they don't even react to it you know it's kind of flat right right but
1:00:45
there's that other element of they're sparked by it it's like okay now I can work with this idea this idea hits with
1:00:52
a lot of people or something yeah I mean when I started doing the
1:00:58
Buddhas you know I was just shocked at the response
1:01:03
but I had probably a thousand ideas connected to
1:01:10
it and I have that a lot with a body of work like I'll see it this way and then
1:01:16
I'll see it that way and I'll see it another way but I won't explore it
1:01:21
unless you know I see that there is that connection to the client you know do they they
1:01:28
connect with it and once I saw that there was people were really loving that body of work I I was doing it a million
1:01:36
different ways to make it oneof a kind and unique and different different shapes and different colors and sizes
1:01:43
and ways and and scale pushing pushing kind of like what kind of
1:01:48
installation type way you can use it I mean it is it's once you know you've kind of hit something or touched on
1:01:55
something then it's like the sky limit yeah and that's one that's it's it
1:02:01
hasn't happened with you know everything but when it does happen I feel like it's
1:02:06
it's so nice for me because I I do tend to think in all of these different ways
1:02:11
like you say with scale and you know wall mounted and freestanding and tabletop and you know different ways to
1:02:18
communicate the idea and it's so nice to have that opportunity to be able to really explore so when it comes to your
1:02:25
work if somebody were to ask you like who you are as an artist you know we have words that kind of jump up you know
1:02:33
like I think I'm a glass artist or you kind of check a bunch of boxes you know
1:02:38
what which is the one that kind of resonates the most is it sculptor is it glass artist you know what is it exactly
1:02:45
for you I think it's sculptor yeah because I just find that
1:02:51
that is what it is is sculpture that's always been and what has excited me as sculpture I mean I look at it recently
1:02:58
I'm like maybe it's mixed media because of the metal stands that I'm you know
1:03:04
designing and creating and then the metal inclusions so I don't even know what to
1:03:09
call it you know I've been in shows where I have you know just thought of it as sculpture and then glass people
1:03:18
be like but it's glass and I'm like yeah it is glass and it does you know get a
1:03:23
lot of it's Beauty from let's just say I like it when you apply in sculpture let's just
1:03:30
say CU you you leave a few spaces for us other glass
1:03:35
contemporaries it's funny sometimes I don't even get in the glass category you
1:03:41
know on the other side of it and I think to myself well maybe that's because it's coming from somebody who's a glass
1:03:46
blower and they're looking at this thing and they're like what the heck is this and I I I you know it has nothing to do
1:03:53
with me so it's funny how it works and then I'm like well maybe it really isn't glass it's sculpture or mixed media and
1:04:00
so that's where I'm I'm working that out for myself where do you fit right where do I fit I fit anywhere well and it's
1:04:08
true I think if somebody's not let's say versed in making glass um they might not
1:04:15
know all the different ways you can can use it and glass sand casting is a
1:04:22
Rarity as you've pointed out so they look at it and go wait a minute that could be a good thing you know it's like
1:04:27
unique but if they don't get it if they think this is what glass is supposed to look like then you know it it's hard to
1:04:34
to know how to navigate your way through that totally yeah so I think sculptor
1:04:39
would be you know I'd say as artist sculptor and then as business owner I'd say
1:04:45
entrepreneur because you know it's it's a business and it's definitely been a
1:04:53
journey a Journey that I have never studied like I said I'm just like you
1:04:58
I'm sure you're figuring it out every step of the way and what works and what doesn't work and you know how to survive
1:05:05
but even talking to people on other artists on the podcast there are so many different business models we're not all
1:05:13
it we show up to a show of let's say 150 artists 200 artists whatever those 150 different artists are operating 150
1:05:21
different ways you know you're not getting up in the morning drinking your cup of coffee walking into your painting
1:05:27
Studio no other support staff around you do your paintings throw them in the back of your your van and head off to the art
1:05:34
fair you've got more cogs in the wheel to to do what you have envisioned and
1:05:39
what you dreamed up to do you know so it we don't all have that same kind of
1:05:45
layout yeah it's it's been an interesting Journey because you know
1:05:51
after college and the way that it's promoted is is more of you know you
1:05:57
should be in museums you should be in Galleries and that's what an artist does
1:06:02
so that was the path that I went out on was getting with the
1:06:08
Galleries and getting the museum shows and that was all difficult because how
1:06:15
do you get the museum shows without the experience or you know with the Galleries and it was just like it was
1:06:22
great and it was a wonderful road until 2008 and then 2008 came everything got
1:06:30
redefined then yeah none of my galleries were selling and I was like okay choices here
1:06:37
what am I gonna do am I gonna be a waiter you know like what what is what
1:06:42
is my we all feel like we're one step away from being a barista don't we some even though we've run these businesses
1:06:49
selling our art that is so specialized we all do feel like well what am I qualified to do if this isn't here
1:06:56
anymore right and it was funny right at the time that you know my husband lost
1:07:02
his job he was um he's an architect and he was doing some property development
1:07:07
so all of that you know crashed he was helping me on the side in the studio
1:07:13
anyway he's helping me a lot and so at that point I'm like well should we just work together completely and bring him
1:07:20
into the family business right bring him into the business because I was doing very well until 2008 everything was
1:07:26
going great and then you know one of my friends who I met somewhere along the
1:07:33
way was like U Marlene I'm doing I'm curating this this um Sculpture Garden
1:07:38
at this Art Festival in coconut Gro and I was like with my nose up you know I
1:07:44
don't do that I'm the schools do that to us don't they they they make us they
1:07:50
make us feel like those are not a respectable path the art show you know the outdoor art fairs art festivals kind
1:07:57
of thing right and the galleries make us feel that way and um so I said I don't
1:08:04
do that and he's like Marina what's happening are you selling right now I'm like no he's like you could make more
1:08:11
money in a weekend than you do all year with one of your galleries or more and I was like
1:08:18
okay you have my interest right you got me you got me on making money in a
1:08:25
year yeah right worth a shot worth a shot so I did it and sure enough I
1:08:32
killed it I made more money in that weekend than I had with a gallery for a
1:08:38
whole year so I was like wow okay let's get on the phone and find what show
1:08:45
every show that I can possibly do that is a festival that's and then I analyze
1:08:50
this is my business side I was like okay so what made that successful was in a very very upscale
1:08:57
area there's like a 100,000 people walk by in in a weekend that's huge numbers
1:09:04
you know so I needed to find you know plus maybe little did you know that that area is especially in love with glass so
1:09:12
and this was you know what almost 20 years ago so yeah so then I started okay
1:09:18
how do I balance these two worlds that I'm in because I'm in this one world
1:09:24
who I know wouldn't appreciate this other world so I would just go to an area that
1:09:30
I didn't have a gallery in and i' try show they don't compete
1:09:36
with their compete with their collectors yeah plus I don't you know undercut the
1:09:41
gallery so it's the price is the price you know so I just make sure it's all the same and that of course there's
1:09:48
discounting in in galleries so I would discount this roughly the same amount
1:09:54
and so there you know should be real no issue and I've keep the worlds very separate you know I just try to to
1:10:01
balance it but you know it has been my My Savior it has been
1:10:08
absolutely what changed everything for me and what's so interesting is that you
1:10:14
know I have a mailing list and that is probably the biggest thing that you know
1:10:19
with galleries they won't give you the name yeah which makes sense because they're doing the work to close it and
1:10:26
they want to be in control of that and I I respect that also if you're
1:10:31
Administration is not good like I ask everybody how did they come to find me and if it's they just saw my work in
1:10:37
gallery a I definitely refer them back but it's it's interesting so I I I
1:10:44
definitely try to keep the Two Worlds separate and what's happened recently
1:10:50
with the decreasing glass collector base every like GL like in every panel that
1:10:56
I've ever ever gone to it's always like they're are dying breed the glass collectors and you know how do we get
1:11:03
new glass collectors it's always the topic and what's been and what's been
1:11:08
happening for me which I really love is like as I said one of my biggest missions is is educating people about
1:11:15
the studio glass movement so when somebody comes to a show that I do and
1:11:21
they don't really know they don't like galleries they feel intimidated they don't know about the studio glass
1:11:27
movement it's like they get on my mailing list and all of a sudden you know they're getting information about
1:11:32
all of these things and I invite them to all of my high-end shows that are at like the art basil every single person
1:11:39
that I've met on the street will be invited to those shows and what's been happening is that they kind of then
1:11:46
start buying through the galleries they either buy my work or they don't but you
1:11:51
know I've helped to bring so many clients to those shows and everybody's
1:11:57
happy the gallery is happy because I have a huge following I don't really care it's like the client will get
1:12:03
whatever they want you know they're going to get what they like it could be mine again which you hope but um I look
1:12:11
at the bigger picture yeah so that's a really good question that I was going to ask you about was how do you keep those
1:12:18
worlds separate except it seems like you really don't it seems like you found a
1:12:25
way to have them work interc connectedly you know what I mean like you have no problem sending a collector to a gallery
1:12:33
where you know you're going to get half of what you would have got if they would have came to you directly you know yeah
1:12:39
so you want to keep feeding both of those funnels for yourself yeah and I
1:12:45
think that I try not to kind of hold back because I think if
1:12:52
you just kind of are free with things it'll all come back to you I really firmly believe in that and
1:13:00
so I honestly the only people I don't promote the
1:13:06
festivals to are my collectors from the galleries but I don't have their names
1:13:12
anyway right right so if they saw you on the road and that's how you got their
1:13:17
name then you're not competing with your your galleries you know ex sure and so
1:13:23
is is is actually good for the galleries because I'm bringing them clients so you
1:13:30
know I don't promote it to any of the galleries that I'm doing these festivals I just kind of keep it on the down low
1:13:35
and the same time they know that I do them because I'm constantly bringing them collectors and and they have to
1:13:42
wonder where are these people how do they know about you you know I do have a gallery and I do your own Gallery I have
1:13:50
my own Gallery yeah and I advertise lot in magazines I advertise in Lux
1:13:57
architectural digest Florida Design like I do a lot especially during covid that
1:14:03
was you know the way that I could get out there because I was not doing any shows no nor was anybody else thank God
1:14:11
for that mailing list because I had somebody to write to and reach out to during the pandemic I don't know what
1:14:18
other artists did I really don't that that got us all through that got any of
1:14:23
us who are still standing that's what got us through was those contacts because they wanted some sense of Art
1:14:31
and connection with other people connection with an idea something that was meaningful and so we did find that
1:14:39
it was scary but a lot of us came through it totally and you know as as
1:14:44
far as like it's super important for me to to ask every time somebody reaches
1:14:50
out where did you hear of me because since I am you know Gallery represented and they are my bread and butter I try
1:14:58
to be very respectful of them and so if it is somebody that is through a gallery
1:15:04
then I turn it back over and just you know sometimes I have to close it and
1:15:10
then send the gallery the money because some people they now that they're connected to you they don't want to not
1:15:16
be connected to you so it's just you know I just try to keep it really honest
1:15:21
and clean and and um and then I find just things go better and and I sell to
1:15:28
my list as well and you know it's it's it's all fine I guess is what I would
1:15:33
say it all works out so you mentioned earlier about your husband Thomas when
1:15:39
you know in 2008 he came into your business of Art and now he is a
1:15:46
full-fledged part of it all these years you know so how would you describe how that transition worked for for the two
1:15:53
of you well I think it's you know it's never easy working with a spouse or it
1:16:00
it potentially could be difficult but I think that we learned
1:16:06
pretty quickly what each one's role was and it's for sure my business and my
1:16:14
artwork now he is a very you're the boss right yeah I'm the boss and as long as
1:16:21
he knows that everything's good no he's um he's super
1:16:27
creative and very much an artist he just chooses to help me I think he might do
1:16:33
some of his own work one one day soon but um but it's funny whenever he has
1:16:41
influenced my decision or I was like oh yeah I like that and it kind of went in
1:16:48
in more his I guess less my thought and more his thought it never sells which is so
1:16:56
fascinating to me about just being true to yourself like you know even in marketing and when
1:17:04
I talk to people who are into marketing they're like you just you know the people who are huge on the social media
1:17:12
is that because they are just being themselves and I was like that's so
1:17:18
fascinating because that that happened to us you know it's like whenever was
1:17:23
like oh let's do it this way and I kind of like lessened myself for for thinking
1:17:29
that's not really what I wanted to do but I was like oh maybe he knows better and uh never sold it just like it
1:17:37
was just never and then we realized we're like okay this is the sign that
1:17:42
it's not a collaborative effort sure this is this is my work and so he's very
1:17:49
he never gives his unless I ask an opinion you know do you like this better this better that's fine but but we never
1:17:56
really creatively go anywhere other than what I think we should be doing so
1:18:02
that's worked out really well so there there are some Growing Pains as far as he's been in charge of his own world and
1:18:09
business and stuff like that an architect is a is a a extremely creative
1:18:14
field but it's different and so to apply uh to apply that you know that
1:18:20
experience to what you're doing maybe that's where some of that that tension came in with with the reaction
1:18:27
to the work when maybe you were leaning more on on what his idea might have been
1:18:33
you know to say well let's try it out and see yeah and I thought you know I was just a little insecure about my ideas
1:18:41
and and but we we saw that it just funny that they just never sold and
1:18:47
so I I just thought that and I said to him when you do your work and you do you
1:18:52
have your voice it's important to just do that and not I shouldn't put my input
1:19:00
of what I think you should be doing so that's really good but he has other strong I mean he's knowledgeable in so
1:19:06
many things that I I really need his input like the engineering of some of
1:19:11
the larger scale pieces and you know right that is vital to like them
1:19:18
withstanding weather the ones that go outdoors and so that's where we're
1:19:24
really a great team because I have the ideas and then he helps me make them
1:19:31
into a reality of you know structure and and now I'm getting pretty good at being
1:19:36
able to just suggest what should be done and then he'll put it in a way that um you know that it translates
1:19:45
for for the welding and he'll put it in a program that is very very translatable
1:19:51
which I wouldn't do so that's where I think we're a great team and he's he's
1:19:57
great with curating and so am I and we work well together on that we usually agree so we work well together and then
1:20:04
he will drive a lot of the time and when I'm I mean my kids are 14 and 16 so
1:20:11
sometimes I'd have to stay back with them when he was driving so that I could be with the kids and for school and
1:20:17
stuff so it's it's been a a really great Road you know having somebody who's
1:20:23
who's that supportive and behind you at right there with you the whole way well
1:20:29
that's awesome okay so a lot of us artists work tirelessly to put our voice
1:20:36
out there and to you know to do what we do and to hopefully like to break through and be seen on kind of a mass
1:20:43
scale and you've actually experienced that with like the national CBS This Morning picked you up
1:20:52
and and and did like a 10minute feature on marinaa Rose could tell me what that
1:20:57
whole process was like for you oh my gosh that was I probably that was the
1:21:03
height of my career I I couldn't believe it but um you know I had wanted to be on
1:21:09
that show I I thought that's one of the few shows that I would fit you know of all the
1:21:15
different shows we could we could possibly be on I just liked it because it was good news and usually about
1:21:22
artists or animals just right up my alley and um so I uh one A friend of
1:21:31
mine who had worked with CBS saw came to my first solo Museum
1:21:37
exhibition in um what was it 2007 and she said oh you should be on
1:21:43
CBS Sunday Morning and I didn't know the show but I researched it I was like oh
1:21:48
yeah I would love to be on that show and she was she was in with the show because
1:21:53
she had helped them find this uh person that was ended up being an award-winning
1:21:59
show for them so I had it in there and so she she showed them my work and me
1:22:06
about me and they said that they really L the work and I was definitely
1:22:12
CBS Sunday Morning material but I wasn't far enough along in my career and so for
1:22:19
them they needed certain criteria for them to do put you on the show and so they were
1:22:25
kind enough to tell her what that was and it was what I was doing already which was the you know the very high-end
1:22:33
art fairs like the art basil type shows and being in museum Collections and just
1:22:39
different stuff like that so I I was doing that here and there but they wanted more of that so once I had more
1:22:49
of that then we repr proposed me to the show and they said yeah she you know
1:22:55
we'd love to do a show on her but we just did a a glass artist and I don't know if it was pul stanker it might have
1:23:01
been pul stanker oh okay um so they weren't going to do a glass artist for a
1:23:06
while because I guess they vary that up and then a few years later I had you know a lot going on so they were ready
1:23:15
but nothing was happening they said they wanted to do the show but then I wasn't getting a
1:23:21
correspondent and and so this lady suggested that I you know they're really
1:23:27
into that sun that's CBS Sunday Morning Sun is their symbol said if you wouldn't mind I mean
1:23:34
it might help our cause if you make that son for them so I made I made the sun I
1:23:41
sent it to them and the executive producer flipped out over it it just
1:23:47
meant a lot to me because you know pictures can't really do the work can never really do the work justice so he
1:23:54
got I feel that way too yeah with glass it's so hard to translate yeah because it's a moment and then it's different
1:24:00
another moment because of the light so when he saw the work he was just like oh
1:24:06
my God who is this and you know our producer was like that that's Marina Ros
1:24:11
you said you wanted to have her on the show and he's like oh my God I want her on the show
1:24:17
now and can I keep the sun you go and they're like yeah of course of course
1:24:25
and it was funny because I was they were thinking about putting me on like some I
1:24:30
don't know it wasn't a a great slot that was viewed by as many people and then
1:24:36
once he saw the work it went to their season premiere show it was um so it
1:24:42
went from nothing to everything like I was in between Hillary Clinton and Olivia Newton John and I couldn't
1:24:49
believe what happened and that to me was just like it it felt like because he got to really experience the work and it was
1:24:57
it was and that made I don't know that just meant so much to me because that's what you hope that people will be moved
1:25:03
by your work well there's an energy to it and once they holding it and in the in the same space with it you know it
1:25:10
resonates so much more than an image that's being sent to them for sure so
1:25:15
yeah it it it transcended there have been Communications for a while that was what pushed him over the
1:25:22
it sounds like totally and then we got their best correspond we just they flew
1:25:28
down it was like they were there for days at each location the gallery the
1:25:33
studio they went to that show that I did the museum show and they so there was
1:25:39
three you know diff four different locations that they came to and um it
1:25:44
ended up coming out the end of September 2019 so right before the pandemic and I
1:25:51
know that that really helped me again it was another thing that helped me survive during that
1:25:57
time because of the residuals and what was like the interest that it generated it kept kept going into 2020 s million
1:26:05
people saw it and then you know we just my whole website crashed because of all the interest and it's there's nothing
1:26:12
like that kind of those numbers it's just I had people calling I still have
1:26:17
people calling I saw you on CBS Sunday Morning and this is now how many years
1:26:22
and so yeah I just I keep thinking to myself
1:26:28
okay how do we top that you know because there's right it's like I don't think there's a lot that's out there that
1:26:35
that's like that show so it was it was definitely the biggest thing that that's
1:26:41
ever happened to me and at a really the perfect time you know when you think you
1:26:47
know 16 years ago when they heard about me it took you know but I don't think I
1:26:52
could have handled a the amount of eyeballs I couldn't have handled the
1:26:58
volume which now I'm set up for you know I I can handle a lot I have a warehouse
1:27:04
full of artwork because that's all I did during the pandemic was make stuff okay
1:27:09
right right I have a lot of inventory right now and so it was just it ended up
1:27:15
being the right time for it to happen so I kind of feel like everything happens
1:27:21
for I remember when I saw that that you were getting that recognition and it felt so
1:27:28
good it felt so exciting even though I mean we weren't like on a you know we weren't like on a social basis with each
1:27:35
other at that point but I just felt like one of our own is getting recognized and it's such a great story and it's just so
1:27:42
exciting so I remember feeling super happy for you in those moments so thank you so much I got so much incredible
1:27:50
support from the community and yeah but it was
1:27:56
um there's nothing like that I I wish there was more things that for for us
1:28:02
like that but yeah it's they're always looking for really interesting artist so
1:28:08
it it's something that I think you know for anybody who's listening it's it's definitely something to reach for
1:28:16
because they're always looking for they need news right they need news the
1:28:23
interesting people that have an interesting story so I think it is
1:28:28
something for our group well perhaps having an appearance on the independent artist podcast would top your the
1:28:36
Morning Experience for sure just with you well Mara this has been an amazing
1:28:43
talk and I really appreciate us getting to know each other a little bit more and learning about you and everything about
1:28:51
your process it's just really it's a really great talk so thank you for taking the time thank you so much for
1:28:58
reaching out and I hope really more than anything that it helps I really hope
1:29:03
that something I said maybe inspires somebody to be an artist and or to
1:29:09
continue and not give up there are so many different ways that you can be an
1:29:14
artist there's so many different entry points mediums our businesses can look
1:29:21
different from one another and you know I I really have enjoyed getting to know
1:29:27
your you know kind of your path into this you know thank you I mean for me I
1:29:32
one of the things that I really enjoy doing is talking with artists meeting
1:29:37
with artists trying to help artists be artists because I feel like you know
1:29:43
everything that we enjoy in life from movies to theater to dance to Art Visual
1:29:51
Arts it's they're it's created by artists and so we need more artists and
1:29:57
I think that if you're a visual artist or whatever that's we have the same
1:30:03
problems as every other artist sometimes you know the path is a little bit more
1:30:09
walked um and sometimes it isn't and that's the thing it's like if we can help each other I think it's so
1:30:14
important and I feel that if people want to reach out I'm really accessible to to
1:30:20
talk to that's one of the things that is important to me to help other artists so I appreciate you even thinking about me
1:30:26
and I hope that I helped yeah well I I do feel like that this project that will
1:30:32
and I are working on is just that it is that that kind of like getting over that
1:30:39
that barrier or that hump of the I feel passionate about being an artist and
1:30:47
then just having these conversations from people who've done it
1:30:52
to not necessarily feel like well if I do it like that then I'll get to where I want
1:30:58
to be but it's to know that that person stuck with it and they found their way
1:31:03
through to the other side and they have these successful careers and have happy
1:31:08
lives I mean aside from the successful career really what we're doing is we're building a life for oursel that is
1:31:14
Meaningful and that you can do that that those people who tell us as young kids
1:31:21
that being an artist is not a way to make a living well we're proving them wrong there so yeah that's right yeah it
1:31:29
is and it can be like you say it's a what you're doing by bringing artists on
1:31:34
the show I think is just helping and that's so important and I I appreciate what you're doing and I appreciate that
1:31:40
you asked me here because it is it is a business like anything else actually
1:31:46
there's no there's not mysterious thing about it it's you know you can go the
1:31:52
gallery route and and pick your gallery as well do that you know what I mean
1:31:57
like let them run the business then and them do the business side and the marketing and that's fine that is
1:32:03
absolutely fine you know you have to pick your gallery so that they're honest
1:32:09
you know there there are ways to do it there's so that's the thing is like you know when I meet with people it's also
1:32:15
okay what is your purpose as an artist what are your goals is it to be
1:32:20
recognized is it to survive off your art you know because there's many different
1:32:25
reasons for doing the art and you just once I know who I'm talking to and what because they could be somebody that
1:32:31
doesn't need to make a living they just want to get out there and then I can help them with that so anyway right I
1:32:39
remember a period in time when Renee and I were kind of finding our way and we thought that doing the wholesale markets
1:32:47
where we would sell to galleries store type Galleries and gallery type galleries
1:32:52
and I got there and it was such a rude awakening because there were so many different kinds of Studio Glass artists
1:33:00
and I remember the advice I got from somebody and they said you need to make the
1:33:06
decision what you want your business to look like do you want to operate under
1:33:14
that threshold of where you have employees doing stuff for you that is UN
1:33:21
menial tasks or whatever you know what I mean that is employable not in the art creating part
1:33:26
but the other stuff or do you want to cross that
1:33:32
threshold and and be supporting a staff
1:33:37
and for some people that makes sense and for other people staying below that line makes sense but it's definitely like you
1:33:43
can cross that threshold and if you're not making what you need to with Revenue
1:33:48
to support the organization then it can all come up apart so it is definitely
1:33:53
kind of like knowing who you are as a business and who you are as a person and how you want your end result
1:34:01
to turn out there just there's no one right way so to speak you know totally
1:34:06
that is so true and that is something to to think about as a as an artist what
1:34:12
type of artist how big do you want staff like you said it's all important well I
1:34:19
think we've come full circle this is a great this has been a great time so thanks so much marinaa and so nice to
1:34:25
meet you thank you for having me I really appreciate it awesome well take care though okay
1:34:31
thanks great talk with Marina Rose Douglas thanks for getting that in this week with everything that we have going
1:34:37
on we are still working through technical difficulties on our our buddy Matt Heming house hope to get him on
1:34:43
next time coming through uh we will iron that out and figure that out but
1:34:48
something to look forward to coming up um something that we are not looking forward to as we get older Douglas uh
1:34:56
wanted to talk for a second about you know just the inevitable health issues
1:35:01
that we all kind of deal with as as the the shows kind of pile up on us and and
1:35:07
the road gets gets heavy on our limbs but um man we've had a couple of couple of hard things to deal with as a
1:35:14
community these past couple weeks we have we've had a couple of friends who've had some health problems we've
1:35:20
got people recovering from the hurricane that's come through so yeah the storm it's a big one too I'm glad you
1:35:27
mentioned that um yes set us up you started a GoFundMe for a couple of those
1:35:33
friends of ours and and I'll let you let you talk a little bit on that one past guest of ours Oliver schnor is now
1:35:39
Oliver hample Jeweler if you remember back his talk where he had the awful
1:35:46
accident with the um circular saw onto his hand he recovered from that and he
1:35:51
You' think that is all the turmoil someone's going to need in a lifetime but he found himself in the hospital
1:35:58
about a month ago yeah and he had to have a double brain surgery and he's
1:36:04
coming back from it but they had to go with a surgon who was out of their
1:36:09
Network for insurance because they were getting conflicting advice on how to
1:36:15
save his life so I'll drop his GoFundMe in the episode notes read over his story
1:36:20
hear what he went through and if you're so inclined to to donate please do and
1:36:25
um yeah and there's some other people out there that will drop their their gofundmes into the episode notes as well
1:36:32
so you can read I was going to mention one um you know our good friend Amy lambsburg who is a board member of Nia
1:36:39
and has done so much for our community really took a massive hit during um the
1:36:45
the latest hurricane her home uh God it's still under what 78 trees minimum I
1:36:52
saw this thing it looked like you know when when the wind blows and you have tall grass in your yard and it kind of
1:36:57
blows flat that's what the pine trees look on top of her home so um that's another important one she's like I said
1:37:05
not just a dear friend but a a a good friend to the community as well and all the work that she's done for the board
1:37:11
of Nia so I'm not sure if there is a GoFundMe on that one but they had been
1:37:16
posting her vinmo I know it's in the works so I will reach out and make it
1:37:21
gets in the episode notes and and then there's also Carol gy who also suffered from a a stroke so she is part of the
1:37:30
team with art and the Pearl in Portland there who's putting on that event so a lot of you who just did Art and the
1:37:37
Pearl are going to know that she's not at the show because she's recovering so
1:37:42
keep all these people in your positive thoughts and send them good help if you can yeah look out for each other out
1:37:48
there absolutely you never know what's going to happen and and even if it's just uh just just some kindness to do
1:37:55
that whether it's it's just a helping hand or or a kind word it it means a lot to to these folks and these valuable
1:38:01
members of our community that that do so much for us well as I look at the time here uh will it's probably supper time
1:38:07
for you and bedtime for me so um I will catch you in a couple weeks we'll see
1:38:13
you in St Louis good all right Budd bye this podcast is brought to you by the National Association of Independent
1:38:19
Artists the website is a IIA artists.org also sponsored by zapplication that's
1:38:26
zapplication.org and while you're at it find us on social media and engage in
1:38:31
these conversations be sure to subscribe to this podcast to be notified when we release new episodes oh and if you like
1:38:37
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