Join co-hosts Douglas Sigwarth https://www.sigwarthglass.com/ and Will Armstrong http://www.willarmstrongart.com/, professional working artists who talk with guests about ART & SELLING. This week's topics include finding inspiration, luck vs logic, and the ripple effect of positive energy.
This week’s guest is Lynn Whipple http://lynnwhipple.com/, a mixed media artist, author, and instructor from Winter Park, Florida. Lynn describes her creative path which centers around "lighting up" the creative energy in her brain to unleash a playful approach to her work. In addition, Lynn reveals how saying "Yes" to opportunities that have pushed her outside of her comfort zone has made for a rewarding life.
Hear Lynn on the Kate Shepherd Podcast "Creative Genius" https://podcasts.apple.com/ca/podcast/16-lynn-whipple-learning-to-trust-your-instincts-through/id1572524424?i=1000555923264
See Lynn on The See Saw Project on YouTube https://youtu.be/PZN5X0MOpY4
.
PLEASE RATE US AND REVIEW US.......... and SUBSCRIBE to the pod on your favorite streaming app.
SUPPORT THE SHOW
VENMO/ username @independentartistpodcast or through PAYPAL.ME by clicking on this link https://paypal.me/independentartistpod?locale.x=en_US
Email us at independentartistpodcast@gmail.com with conversation topics, your feedback, or sponsorship inquiries.
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Sponsors
The National Association of Independent Artists (NAIA). http://www.naiaartists.org/membership-account/membership-levels/
ZAPPlication https://www.zapplication.org
Music "Walking" by Oliver Lear
Business inquiries at theoliverlear@gmail.com
https://soundcloud.com/oliverlear
https://open.spotify.com/artist/5yAPYzkmK4ZmdbWFLUhRNo?si=i6Y8Uc36QZWIDKIQfT3XFg
Join co-hosts Douglas Sigwarth https://www.sigwarthglass.com/ and Will Armstrong http://www.willarmstrongart.com/, professional working artists who talk with guests about ART & SELLING. This week's topics include finding inspiration, luck vs logic, and the ripple effect of positive energy.
This week’s guest is Lynn Whipple http://lynnwhipple.com/, a mixed media artist, author, and instructor from Winter Park, Florida. Lynn describes her creative path which centers around "lighting up" the creative energy in her brain to unleash a playful approach to her work. In addition, Lynn reveals how saying "Yes" to opportunities that have pushed her outside of her comfort zone has made for a rewarding life.
Hear Lynn on the Kate Shepherd Podcast "Creative Genius" https://podcasts.apple.com/ca/podcast/16-lynn-whipple-learning-to-trust-your-instincts-through/id1572524424?i=1000555923264
See Lynn on The See Saw Project on YouTube https://youtu.be/PZN5X0MOpY4
.
PLEASE RATE US AND REVIEW US.......... and SUBSCRIBE to the pod on your favorite streaming app.
SUPPORT THE SHOW
VENMO/ username @independentartistpodcast or through PAYPAL.ME by clicking on this link https://paypal.me/independentartistpod?locale.x=en_US
Email us at independentartistpodcast@gmail.com with conversation topics, your feedback, or sponsorship inquiries.
Facebook https://www.facebook.com/independentartistpodcast
Instagram https://www.instagram.com/independentartistpodcast/
Website https://www.sigwarthglass.com/independentartistpodcast.html
YouTube https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCHxquKvRx9sI_DuXRLy-tyA
Mailing List http://eepurl.com/hwQn7b
Sponsors
The National Association of Independent Artists (NAIA). http://www.naiaartists.org/membership-account/membership-levels/
ZAPPlication https://www.zapplication.org
Music "Walking" by Oliver Lear
Business inquiries at theoliverlear@gmail.com
https://soundcloud.com/oliverlear
https://open.spotify.com/artist/5yAPYzkmK4ZmdbWFLUhRNo?si=i6Y8Uc36QZWIDKIQfT3XFg
0:12
artist podcast sponsored by the National Association of Independent Artists also
0:19
sponsored by zapplication I'm will Armstrong and I'm a mixed media artist I'm Douglas sigworth glassblower join
0:26
our conversations with professional working artists
0:34
Douglas sigworth I could not be less happy to see your smiling face here this morning how are you today is the day
0:41
that we just released Bennett's episode and we usually have a little breather a
0:46
couple days from each other maybe a week and we can kind of like you know prepare for the next one but we're both rushing
0:51
off here and so we're jumping right into the next one there's no way I'm taking my microphone and my little portable
0:57
Studio here on the road so we're recording this one on the Fly what's going on what's going on is I am maybe
1:03
about five bins away from slamming the back door shut on my van and I'm ready
1:08
to head south head down to the land of music and food and art and you know I'm
1:16
excited about you going to New Orleans Jazz Fest I'd be lying if I said I wasn't completely jealous my wife and I
1:22
did not get into that one this year neither one of us um I've actually never gotten a dip at the well at that one so
1:27
congratulations thank you I'm I'm super excited and it's the thing where we got juried in in 2020 so we got we got the
1:34
notice in 2019 teen and then we all know what happened after that so there was the constant rolling over of this event
1:41
and for it to be finally happening I'm just so enthused I'm really happy for
1:47
you also uh don't talk about it anymore I'm really tired of it I'm kidding I hear you I hear you no but listen it's
1:53
my first time going so of course I'm gonna sound all giddy and happy about it so I don't profess to be like the one
1:58
who juries into jazz fest every single year so I it's funny though that one because of the constant rollovers I
2:06
haven't even had a chance to reapply for what three years now so it's uh it's a
2:11
tough one one thing you said last week that was kind of interesting that's been stuck in my mind this weekend because we
2:17
just recorded it a couple days ago um yesterday about That Jazz Fest thing
2:23
you know another what you you're talking about the fact that you know you're
2:28
gonna have to be ready to pack and ship things but one thing that I think you're going to be really surprised about that
2:34
event is that it's such a a neighborhood thing like it's actually a neighborhood party people just they come out on their
2:41
porches you're going to see people walking with their chairs from blocks away just from their own front porches
2:46
it's just an amazing neighborhood event it's like International talent but just total neighborhood New Orleans thing
2:53
that you're just going to get to be a part of so uh have a blast eat all the food if you're on any kind of diet if
3:00
you and Renee are watching any kind of calories throw it out the window okay
3:05
eat all the food drink all the drinks have an amazing time uh that's I
3:10
appreciate that because the you know this this topic this conversation I had
3:16
with Lynn today was really kind of get me back in the game of being enthused
3:21
about doing things again I mean I noticed last episode when we were recording and I'm I'm like stressing
3:27
about the details about preparing for the show and it was kind of sucking some of the joy out of it and so it just
3:34
feels really great first of all to have had her kind of get my head on straight again and to remember why we're in this
3:40
business it's to live life and to have experiences and you know to to take
3:46
advantage of the fact that I'm going to like the coolest Festival in the world with this awesome music and awesome food
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and yeah there's some art there too but you know what I'm saying it's going to be a huge awesome sorry well I'm I'm I
3:59
can see you're you're shrinking before my eyes I just you started in I just like just
4:06
tell me when you're done Dude tell me I just want to let you know to keep me humble we were talking about being in
4:12
this this great show this great opportunity I got a rejection last week which
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oh man it did a number on my head oh yeah which uh who gave you the I don't want to talk about which show it was but
4:24
it's one of those shows that's a good show and it's a show that I do regularly and and you kind of feel like even
4:30
though you know it's competitive and there are some shows that you you stop kind of feeling like you have to hold
4:36
your breath on that maybe you kind of feel like it's it's a thing that you're going to be there didn't get in yeah it's like oh riding this wave in this
4:43
business is hard it is you know I totally know what you mean and it's it's I never like to admit when I don't get
4:50
into a show especially when you start talking to clients when they're like oh are you going to be at so and so and you're like oh you know it didn't fit
4:56
with my schedule this year is always my line that's my yeah with my schedule I
5:02
didn't fit with their uh you know as opposed to the some of the artists online call it the pfu the police
5:08
off is is uh what you get instead of a an acceptance or a whatever you know it
5:15
does keep you humbled Douglas but you never know I mean sometimes some of those shows you don't get in and it they
5:20
do you a favor you get into something else there was a hell of a weather weekend totally this past weekend in
5:26
both Oklahoma City who had tornadoes and then South Lake gosh we also had South
5:33
Lake that had the threat of rain all Sunday and I don't know if they ever got it on Sunday evening as at Paco I did
5:40
hear that they broke down the show earlier did they really that people were able to some people were were thinning
5:46
out because they're looking at radar and looking at the inevitable started thinning things out until the show gave
5:52
the actual go-ahead and then it was like get out of town before everything turns into chaos here so I think they were
5:59
given enough notice and warning to to kind of protect it that's nice it's it's kind when the show keeps us in mind not
6:06
just until five o'clock when the show is over but five to seven when we have to be packing up our precious belongings
6:12
you know a lot of people can't you know I I can't throw that stuff in the truck wet you know especially if you're going
6:17
to be leaving or you can't unpack it for two weeks and and all that so if it blows over on the ground and hits the
6:24
ground we've got broken glass so then it's like it's a it's a losing proposition as opposed to making sales
6:30
so yep we all know the challenges you know one of the things that Lynn and I
6:35
talked a little bit about but I wanted to talk more about it with you is the
6:40
nature of our business of kind of this showing up being in person and being our
6:46
own bosses that we have this need to impose deadlines on ourselves in order
6:53
to put our backs up against the wall to have that tension to have that that push
6:58
in that point in and that Yang in order for us to really like keep propelling ourselves I think that's why everybody
7:04
struggled through covet we didn't have any kind of imposed deadlines it's like well if you'd been able to have those
7:10
kind of deadlines on yourself during covid we all would have had just just reams of artwork all the way through I
7:17
remember one director saying you know after somebody canceled a show saying what the hell have you guys been doing
7:23
for the past year now drinking I did bristle at that but at
7:29
the same it's like never mind your own business mind your own business quit sending me
7:36
emails well we all have to walk at each other's shoes I mean yeah they might not
7:42
understand the delicate balance you know go talking about the delicate balance I read an article that was posted online
7:49
after Dogwood that the executive director did an interview with their local paper talking about how their
7:57
festival and they presumed a number of other in-person events I don't know if
8:03
they were limiting it to art shows or if they were saying in general are struggling because they can't get
8:08
volunteers they can't get funding they lost money through covid behind the scenes it might be a little more Touch
8:15
and Go than we all know right with some of these events yeah that's terrifying I
8:20
know we've all struggled this this past few years and we're still kind of struggling to put the pieces together
8:25
but it was a scary article to read which is why I didn't read it uh
8:34
no chance yeah well what do you think about that
8:40
kind of like that riding that wave of uncertainty I mean do you you you seem
8:45
kind of like a logical intellectual kind of person who like I don't know that
8:51
it's there are some people when you say that meant to be thing about well if I
8:56
didn't get into that show maybe it wasn't meant to be that Kismet that like higher power kind of looking down on us
9:02
kind of you know how do you feel about that whole topic or that situation uh
9:07
part of me I I'm kind of like I've got the Yen and the Yang it's like I've got my lucky shirt and then I'll wear you
9:15
know I've got I've got this shirt this short sleeve shirt that I that I've been wearing it that shows the last year yeah
9:22
I've only worn it a you know a handful of times but I don't wear it in my regular life it's uh that's only my show
9:29
shirt and it's get it's got killer money in it it's Gotta you know it I may have burned it out in Fort Worth but it's I
9:36
feel like that shirt's got money in it that's horse
9:42
you know I feel good in that shirt and if you feel good you're gonna do uh well
9:47
so that I know it's like Michael schwegman and I are he's one of my very best friends and I and I I talked to him
9:54
uh a lot about luck and logic and he
9:59
does not believe in luck at all and I can't tend to kind of fall more in his
10:04
line it's like well it's really just logic you know you have these these things that you go through and if you're
10:10
set up with your business plan you're like if I have X amount of this if I can sell x amount of this then the bright
10:16
people come along then I can sell one or two of the big thing I mean that's really more of your your business model
10:22
and it has more to do with feeling good being open to the sale
10:28
imagining yourself in the right place and being there and and setting yourself up for Success than it does luck I don't
10:36
really believe in in total luck to be honest total well so you you create the space
10:42
for you to be in the right mindset yes well not just that but you you create
10:49
the space for yourself to be in the right mindset but you have to be in the right show too I could be in the right mindset in you know at the hearing aid
10:57
Festival in Wisconsin I I I'm not going to make any money I hear is an amazing
11:03
show and I know that's that's that's good application
11:08
you hear it's great come on Douglas all right uh but you know what I mean and
11:14
I'm not sure I know totally yeah well an extension from that is not just in the sales aspect of things but something
11:21
that Lynn talks about in her book is she talks about doing that same kind of
11:28
technique with getting ourselves in the creative zone for making our work if
11:34
we're showing up to work and we've got this long list of things we need to do
11:39
we need to finish this piece for a gallery we have a commission for for somebody we've got to get ready for this
11:45
show and we're only thinking of the external and repeating the old formula it's so hard to be creative and so hard
11:52
to bring ourselves to that place but if we create a space where we prime the
11:58
pump she calls it we play we get enthused about our work again that then
12:04
you get those juices flowing and then you kind of shift back into that lane and that's what's worked for her over the years is to allow herself the
12:10
freedom to be expressive and creative I know that's important the problem that I run into with that I know it's important
12:17
and I know I need to take the time but sometimes I feel like I don't have the time to take the time to make the time
12:23
it's just it's like oh my God I just have to get to work and then I realize like well I'm a lot more productive if I
12:30
exercise during the day I can't be productive you know I'm sitting there I'm at the easel my line quality is not
12:36
great I'm working on this piece and I'm like I'm taking breaks and I'm stepping back I'm like you know
12:43
if you wouldn't just panic and try to work through it if you just take an
12:48
hour-long hike and get outside then you'd come back in and the quality of your work would be much better so I I
12:55
can't wait locks it yeah it does and I can't wait to hear the talk for me what gets in the way for me
13:01
has been over the years the fear of wasting expensive raw materials
13:08
so with glass you kind of feel like everything we make needs to have an outcome it needs to be like we're making
13:14
a vase for somebody or vessel we're making something that has to turn out
13:21
exactly how it's envisioned why I got into glassblowing as I like the conversation with the material where
13:27
it's like the material does this and then I do that and it's like this kind of like how we yin and yang back and
13:32
forth when we're talking here we kind of ebb and we flow and when I'm working in
13:38
that it has to look this way or it has to turn out that way that can really it can really put the brakes on create can
13:45
you be more of um I mean you are an artist but you're also a bit of a Tradesman you and Renee
13:52
um yeah when she is into like say Renee's into a headspace can she just
13:59
be a worker can she just be a Tradesman if she's not in a creative space or can
14:04
you back each other um I haven't talked about this on the podcast we really operate as one person
14:11
even though we're partnership in our work because the way we work is we
14:17
design the work together but then in the execution of it there's one person who has to be What's called the gaffer when
14:24
you're a glassblower the gaffer is the person who's making those instinctual kind of decisions as the piece is
14:30
evolving and changing we can't step back from our easel we don't have it easier and say should we add a little more blue
14:36
to that should we do a little that it's like playing soccer it's like somebody just kicked you a ball and you've got a quickly instinctually react to it so I
14:45
take the lead I'm the gaffer at the beginning of the piece we do the layering based on how we've planned it
14:50
out but there's variances on how every single piece is going to turn out with how we I layer all the clear and the
14:56
colored glass onto our blowpipe then I hand the piece over to her and she does the final shaping and the form which
15:03
basically divides the workload in half but throughout the process one of us is
15:08
the leader and one of us is the follower so if the leader isn't there to show up and they can't do their part of it then
15:15
it's a wasted day so we find other things I guess that's my my question like if you if you start in like you
15:20
can't just be you can you just lean into the the utilitarian uh factor it's like
15:26
I know how X Y and Z goes it's like a bricklayer almost where you the creative
15:31
part has happened in the past and you can just lean into the past works we both have made work from start to finish
15:38
as students and Ben like the gaffer all the way through and we could do it again
15:43
but our uniqueness of how we do our work is our work reflects the partnership so
15:50
the work reflects how I described our situation and if I finished a piece for example if Renee's got a pinched nerve
15:56
in her shoulder or something and I finished the pieces it would look like a different body of work it would look like a different artist right on
16:03
um so this work that we do is reflective of the steps that we do so yeah those
16:09
are that's just how we have to have to do things that's good um so it's an interesting week this week because I
16:15
have not actually listened to the Lin Whipple talk yet typically I'll get a chance to listen to the interview and
16:21
then I'll you know reflect on it or lead up to it this time I can just I can just
16:27
assume or uh guess what your talk is going to be about I'm always like
16:33
um I'm looking forward to hopefully getting to talk to John Whipple further down the line but what I've always loved
16:39
about the Whipples is their creativity John's headiness and lens
16:45
energy and action and her personality comes through into her painting so I'm
16:50
excited to kind of lean into some of that personality getting to know them what really strikes me is they have
16:57
different personalities but what they both have at the heart of it is their willingness to play they both are very
17:05
playful and joyful when it comes to their work and just trying stuff and letting things evolve and creating a
17:12
space for inspiration so I kind of felt a little bit like I was having a talk with brene brown uh during this
17:20
interview so maybe some people will find a little bit of that uh no shame you
17:25
know this has been uh it's funny that you say that because it kind of segues out of a couple weeks ago we talked to
17:30
Bennett which is has been actually not that long ago in real time yes but uh they're going from brene Brown and Glenn
17:37
and Doyle and Abby uh talking to it's it's a bit of a feminist motivational
17:42
speaker uh chunk it's been an powering couple of weeks right absolutely we went
17:48
from toxic masculinity back into feminist empowerment so I'm I'm excited about this yin and yang section of the
17:55
podcast let's get right into the talk Douglas you want to let's do it let's turn this interview on with Lynn Whipple
18:01
from Winter Park Florida this episode of The Independent artist podcast is brought to you by zap the
18:08
digital application service where artists and art festivals connect I see here there are some new features with
18:14
the events list category through zap which will help us with looking up new shows to fill a spot in our schedule you
18:21
know I feel like I should have something to say but I wasn't really listening to you because I'm looking at the events list right now and it's pretty cool okay
18:29
so you drop the menu down and there at the bottom go scrolling all the way about third thing down in the smaller
18:34
print it just says events list that's right all of the shows appear here regardless of their application deadline
18:40
you can use filtering and sorting to narrow down your search to find the
18:45
right show that fills your desired time frame or location I know a lot of people love that calendar I like seeing the
18:52
list of events I like scrolling through and doom scrolling late at night it's like online dating they don't let you
18:59
swipe left or right but you can figure out who you want to date coming up here Lynn welcome to the podcast I'm so happy
19:06
that you're here with me today I'm so happy to be with you Douglas I listened to the podcast and I love
19:15
I know we've talked about having you on for a while and I have to say the way we
19:22
organize our talks does come pretty organically and it kind of feels like
19:28
things have their moment and I really am having a moment right now where I need
19:34
to talk to Lynn Whipple
19:44
it's hard sometimes this job we do because it's not just one job it's a thousand little jobs that we wear the
19:51
hat of so many right and you also have a few professional jobs on top of just
19:57
having the multiple jobs it takes to be an artist you know you take on the role of author and the role of teacher and
20:04
all that kind of stuff and I don't know what I'm doing I just try and share the stuff that I love and
20:10
that really is it I had no idea how to write a book I thought I used to sit out there and my little student go I guess
20:16
this sucker's not going to write itself I guess I start putting things down it was just like a painting really just
20:22
start throw some stuff at the canvas and then start moving it around and editing it nobody tells you how to write a book
20:28
I'll tell you that like I thought oh they're gonna coach me along you know nope they didn't really I just had to do
20:33
it that was something I wanted to talk about was that an opportunity that that came to you organically or is that
20:39
something that you thought I'd like to write a book and you sought out that opportunity it was kind of twofold I
20:45
think a long time ago I can't really even remember my cats here what he's
20:50
gonna get involved I think it might have been through Carla Sondheim who I was teaching online classes with and Carla
20:57
is marvelous and she has gosh eight books or something and they're all
21:02
creative so I think she might have put me in touch with someone and then it
21:07
just took off from there I see I think she emailed and I sort of followed up
21:13
and off we went do you have one book more than one book no I just have one but Carla so she was a great sort of a
21:21
cheerleader and and an inspiration you know she's like oh I think you have a book let me reach out to Quarry
21:28
publishing it was the name of it when she said you have a book did she mean your teachings like the technical
21:34
teachings of paint how to paint or was it more of that mentoring part of it that that you can do this this is life
21:41
lesson kind of thing that you have going as well yeah it was sort of a combination I think it was because I had
21:48
a really popular class about painting really loose flowers and layering and
21:53
not worrying and spinning the canvas and all that and it was so um fun and freeing for people that she
22:00
thought that would probably make a good book so it kind of went that path and and then it sort of got infused with
22:06
just the way I think about life and you know let's not worry let's make it fun
22:11
you know let's do that so that kind of got filled into the book as well that does kind of seem like the root of how
22:19
you operate you kind of boil it down to that creating a creative space for
22:24
yourself definitely that's a beautiful way to put it and then giving yourself the freedom
22:31
to mess it up to muck it up to try something new it's like for me that's the best part but something always comes
22:38
out of it you know or you can cut it up or you can just like if you just get something going you know
22:44
before you know it something starts to build and you just respond and move and go and move and that's the only way I
22:50
know how to do anything I watched your seesaw episode last night to kind of get my head in the lid whistle Zone
22:59
it was good it was really good oh thanks you know I didn't know what I was doing
23:04
at all I just had like a little camera you know out there and I just here we are this is our little life so yeah it
23:10
was fun well that's gonna kind of be in my mind the Crux of our talk is putting
23:18
ourselves in positions that you know trying new things or whatever and and how that just organically sends us down
23:25
a path that is good and exciting I think it's good I think you have to work with
23:31
what you love you know use your own brain and you know we all have a different way of processing so if you
23:36
just work with how your brain works and off you go you know to kind of invite yourself up and just see what happens
23:43
that's that's my way no where did that where did that come
23:48
from I mean is that from childhood is that how you were raised yeah I guess so I never really thought about where it
23:54
came from but you know my mom was a high school teacher creative writing in English and she was an artist and we
24:01
went to art festivals with her in the summer when she wasn't teaching and she was a painter and a sculptor and just a
24:09
great fun mom she did all of our sets you know painted our sets for our school plays and like she was that Mom so I
24:16
just it was all around us my grandmother we had a piano my grandmother played piano my sister just could draw like
24:22
great funny animals and stuff that's just what we did so it isn't like you're like the lone creative duck in the
24:28
family it almost seems like you come from a tribe of creatives a bunch of ducks a bunch of creative dogs
24:38
well that's cool I mean I I mean that's the I that's the ideal for any of us artists I think a lot of artists kind of
24:45
feel like they are an alien in their tribe of family members like you know who we have to escape and make this this
24:52
return to or this Evolution into what we want to create in life and kind of strip
24:58
this baggage but you didn't come into this with that kind of creative baggage it sounds like I didn't honestly I
25:05
didn't I know my husband John who's a great artist was always an artist as a kid his dad was very worried for him
25:12
that he could make a good living the joke is why don't you be an orthodontist like they'd whisper in his ear when he was sleeping orthodontist you know
25:20
but because they loved him and I wanted him to succeed in life and his dad was kind of a business guy so they steered
25:29
him away even from Fine Art and he's agree in a degree in graphic design so there is this pressure because they want
25:35
you to succeed you know but I didn't I did not have that pressure okay so they
25:41
were in encouraging a creative field that you could also make a paycheck at basically is one here and you say that
25:47
that they endorsed that like they realized yeah he's he's a we've got a creative kid here and we're not going to
25:53
turn him into an orthodontist but at least they cut a half endorsed a creative life
25:59
exactly and it was all out of love you know they just want him to do well but I
26:05
can see you know just I have that experience knowing his family but then he did well you know he's and then his
26:11
dad would just light up like oh my God okay the kids are gonna make it like he was so proud of us having two artists
26:18
somehow you know putting it together we know I mean half the time we were like we don't know what the heck we're doing
26:24
but we just kept showing up and somehow you know we were able to pay the bills barely sometimes but we did it
26:31
so he began to trust that we were on the right track and you know as as a dad wanting the best he endorsed our Crazy
26:40
Life the parents are okay when they feel like okay maybe the kid isn't going to be
26:45
coming and asking for a loan every couple of weeks they could feel like okay they can stand on their own two feet
26:51
exactly exactly and maybe they'll take care of us one day you know there's that right you know we won't have to take
26:58
care of them forever maybe it'll all work out but it worked out so you said John went on for graphic design but
27:03
yourself were you in the Arts did you go to college to be an artist so that's I think another reason now
27:09
that we're talking about it that I didn't have that I didn't have a degree I mean I always made art I studied art
27:15
my mom made art my sister like my granddad painted everybody was just doing it but I did not get a degree so I
27:23
sought out knowledge my reading and traveling and art museums and books and you know I was always interested went to
27:29
museums all that stuff but I did not have a degree and I don't like that lifelong learner yeah that enthusiasm is
27:37
what led you down the path to the next next thing exactly so you met John and
27:44
the two of you were working for for Nickelodeon is that how you guys met and that's yeah we was kind of
27:50
yeah and he was so stinking cute and I was like hmm this guy's pretty cute you know you know how you do yeah
27:58
I really like good legs and he's also I was an athlete you know in college he had a running scholarship I told my
28:04
girlfriends if he wears shorts tomorrow because we were in this film class that's how we really met and then we got
28:10
our jobs okay and I said if you wear shorts tomorrow and he just got good legs I'm going in you know I'm gonna see
28:16
about this guy I didn't know him at all and he I remember he would be sitting in
28:21
class drawing everyone like he was drawing I could tell you know how somebody's staring at and you kind of know I could tell he was drawing me and
28:28
then but he was drawing her and him and everyone so there was that weird kind of cool thing so your spark was really yeah
28:34
he wore shorts the next day and awesome legs and I'm like oh I've got to
28:40
find out more about this guy and the cool thing about that was in this film
28:45
class it was uh put on by the state of Florida to train people for films coming here you know it was a big new business
28:52
in this area and like Universal Studios and all that that all that jazz all right right because you're in Winter
28:57
Park near Disney so yeah Universal all that stuff theme parks out there so
29:04
um we this was actually really a good memory we were tasked to make a third of
29:10
a feature film this is how this class went and it was backed by Steven Spielberg it was there was special money
29:17
given to it by Africa who the president was then that's terrible Rhino bacon or something so it was this really
29:23
interesting thing that we got to be a part of this all these professionals teaching us how to actually make a film
29:28
and we made a film a third of a film so we had to find our locations and I'm out looking for locations and all these
29:34
weird streets and finding props and I found this cool building and it was all
29:40
um it was just weird and covered in plants and I was looking through the
29:46
window and I saw this cool old horse and it was made out of plaster a life-size
29:51
sort of a you know carousel horse made out of plaster and I thought it was so cool so the next day at school I told
29:57
him I found this place and it's got this horse and oh my God it's the coolest building it's got old barn doors and
30:03
he's like you're describing my studio that's my horse I made that oh my gosh I
30:08
was like oh my gosh exactly is this is more than just the physical
30:15
attraction this is like this is like the creative soulmate that you're meeting up
30:21
with at this point in time yeah it was great because I thought he's super talented and he's fun and funny and
30:26
smart he's all the stuff so yeah that's how we met yeah well I guess I had made the leap incorrectly that that you guys
30:33
met at Nickelodeon so then how did the two of you end up there from college so
30:39
we got out of this film training program you know this and it was months and months long and then we the classes were
30:46
held on universal the lot where the sound stages were and
30:51
then right about then Nickelodeon came in they had just built you know their big sound stages in Florida on that lot
30:58
and it was just a fluke thing like one guy that was in our class this big tall guy and he's like if you go right now to
31:05
that Sound Stage over there and tell him you're willing to do anything they're gonna hire you and we literally just
31:12
walked over there and said hi-tailed it and they're saying they said do you know
31:18
how to paint like they were stressed out do you know how to paint can you spray paint a fish and I say yes and they go
31:24
okay here's a bunch of foam this big and uh we need you to spray paint four fish and blah blah blah blah blah and I was
31:30
like okay so there it was and we worked there and that started there that was it it was
31:37
just like a total fluke and then I'm like telling other people oh you guys come on over they need people like just
31:43
come come right now you know and and let's yeah and we all started working there it's a real organic way of doing
31:50
things it's like you know you're you're in college you're doing the film clusters you got the art thing and then
31:55
it's like we just kind of like whatever thing gets shaking in front of our face we go I'm going in that direction and
32:01
then that takes you down a path and then you're going in that direction so yeah working there that laid the groundwork
32:08
for working in a professional kind of creative type job did it give you the
32:14
awareness of kind of the vision of where you wanted to go personally yourselves like where your life wanted to go from
32:20
there I think it did I think it was so creative it was so much fun like we were
32:26
just this band of kind of idiots we called the art department and we were sort of off to the side of course and
32:32
then we had to create all the sets and the props and the you know paint everything and just we had to make the
32:38
whole you know backdrop for everything that they were filming and it was just like kids TV so it was fun and yeah but
32:44
we just had so much fun but we started salvaging like parts of the sets you know they're built with Flats these
32:50
little chunks of wood you know yeah and we'd take them out of the garbage and we'd like paint on them and then we we
32:56
learned how to do all the scenic paintings so we would just kind of use that in our paintings and we were sort
33:02
of this tribe of artists that we're all making our own stuff but we were working at Nickelodeon so it just kind of built
33:09
ah and we're still friends we have a lot of friends that are still from that time like great people I have a background in
33:16
theater I was a theater major in college and had to do a lot of we had to take
33:21
all different disciplines behind the theater even though I knew I wanted to be a performing major I still spent a
33:27
lot of time in the scene shop and having to do all all that stuff so I following you that whole story I totally get it
33:34
we'd do a play and after the play we'd all ripped the muslin off the flats and it would be like tacked to my apartment
33:39
room walls you know what I mean yeah yeah right I love that you did that
33:46
it makes perfect sense because you have that great personality and you're so easy with just communicating and you
33:52
know that's that comes through it's certainly definitely like you do what you like and then the path kind of just
33:59
unfolds itself that's it so for you what led you out of of Nickelodeon and kind
34:06
of being your own person kind of determining your your own paths as as an
34:11
artist you know that was um kind of an interesting path too because at the same time John's family had
34:18
started a big Warehouse with what do we have back then at one point we had 42 artists or something in a gallery in the
34:25
front but anyway so we had a big Studio that we went to after work and we would be painting all night and we shared this
34:31
big space and so we were always doing our art all the way along and we would
34:37
do the occasional art show and then we were starting to get collectors it was like all this like oh my God this is
34:44
this could work this could work and we just you know so it's like the balance started where things were kind of here
34:51
and then you guys with this network of people in the art Department you were
34:56
building a tribe over here and this this studio started to show you that there
35:01
was life outside of Nickelodeon yes because we could do our own ideas that
35:09
was the thing about Nickelodeon we were doing somebody else's script and ideas it was so fun but we you just thought
35:15
gosh you know let's do what we want let's paint what we want let's so we we
35:20
finally took these risks and said no because we'd get another show yeah most
35:26
people would like kill to get that show you know we were doing well right you know working hard and the stability of
35:32
the paycheck is very intriguing and enticing and gives a lot of security yeah but it was fun
35:40
and learning it was always yeah a lot to do but then we said if let's just put
35:45
that energy into our stuff and see what happens and slowly it just click you
35:51
know big sale oh my God oh my God you know and you go okay and then we used to just do Florida shows and I remember
35:57
when we got you know all ballsy and we said we're gonna go all the way across the country to Kansas City and then we
36:04
did it okay and it was great you know we made all this money which was not a lot of money but it was like oh oh my God so
36:10
now we're on the road now we're you know further and further out in the country figuring it out yeah the world just
36:17
opened wide the possibilities became Limitless exactly it's yeah you know
36:23
that that Starry Eyed every time you were in the van on your way to a show it's like so fun it's got new work and
36:29
you're just like seeing your friends I mean it's a great adventure you know we love this life it's a fun life it's an
36:36
adventurous life and it's a good reminder when it seems
36:42
like like the schedule gets packed full and there it's when you start squeezing
36:48
yourself in with so many commitments that those Adventures those trips when
36:54
they start losing they're kind of like Wonder and they're what am I going to
36:59
come across you know in this part of the country or whatever then it starts to
37:04
feel like work and it starts to feel like you have to come back to your roots of looking for those those opportunities
37:11
for inspiration to jump in I totally agree and there's definitely times when it's work like setting up and it's hot
37:18
and you've been driving and you stayed up you know until super late finishing stuff before you know we we used to be
37:26
really late people we started we've gotten a little smarter over the years like we just say okay let's you know not
37:31
wear ourselves to the Bone and then get on the road for three days and that you know but anyway
37:37
it's the Wonder is there no you just have to say Okay instead of just like
37:42
barreling down the road I see a sign for the Kentucky Bluegrass Hall of Fame I
37:48
think maybe we should stop and like okay Jazz yourself back up make yourself
37:54
available to those surprises yeah because that's the fun right right well we were in Sun Valley last uh August and
38:03
first time we'd ever been there and during the whole entire show we keep looking up and we're seeing these people
38:08
paragliding off the side of the big mountain Hills or whatever right and
38:13
Renee keeps turning to me and she's saying we've got to do that on Monday I look at her I'm like are you kidding me I cannot believe that you would feel
38:21
brave enough or would want to you know do that I said you realize we have to like hold on to this thing and we have to like run as if we're gonna run right
38:28
off the edge of the hill or later on that's going to take us take us off she was all for it so she actually had me
38:35
talked into it I was reluctantly willing to give it a shot but they were closed
38:40
on the Monday and we weren't there still so we couldn't do it so maybe next where we are in in Sun Valley this year so I
38:46
think she's going to want us to factor in either a day before or a couple days after to stick around and give that one
38:52
a shot see I love that you were willing to do it see that's the whole thing you know God I've been wanting to do that
38:58
forever paragliding like we did we did a whole show season where we did every zip line
39:03
that we came to like we had we had a plan and uh-huh Dear John he John hates
39:09
Heights he does not like heights
39:16
and he's like do we really have to go to another I'm like honey it's it's the blah blah blah this one it's so special
39:21
so anyway we he is a good sport but the paragliding thing he somehow always man
39:27
oh I missed the turn like he doesn't he found a way to he had a way to even keep
39:34
me off of it because I think I even if I go to the edge of a building you know up
39:39
high I'll go right to the edge and uh he'll like oh God can you come back and come closer you know he's really not a
39:47
height guy well I didn't know it at that point but I was probably taking a little
39:52
bit of your advice which is to always be willing to say yes yeah
39:59
I mean that's one of your things right to say yes that got me everywhere I've gone and I I'll so many yeses I said I
40:07
was like I have no clue well how to do this thing I just said yes to like that's how I got into teaching
40:15
online and I remember agreeing to it and I'm thinking I have no clue how this
40:20
works I guess there and they flew to my studio and set up stuff and I'm like okay here we go I just started doing
40:28
what I do and I was like I guess that worked out and then it did it was a
40:33
beautiful partnership you know for I don't know six seven years we haven't done much since covid but yeah I had no
40:39
clue you know but but the thing about art you know art teaches us you don't
40:45
necessarily know the outcome so you gotta just step in and then you react to the next thing like you don't learn
40:51
stuff or I don't all in one gulp like I don't know but if I just take each step I get a little bit of information and
40:57
then you know I can get there it's problem solving right it's like if we chart our own course of okay this is
41:04
what I want to learn and this is how I'm going to learn it and this is what I'm going to learn by the end of it it's
41:09
like no you have to learn it by experiencing it and allowing the discoveries to come exactly it's got to
41:17
be open enough that because you you don't know what you don't know but you got to be willing to walk down the path
41:25
and if you hate it you just don't go that way you know you change yeah yeah well then you can say no yeah I mean I
41:32
mean you're not saying that you you have to say yes to every aspect of the
41:37
process you still know what's right and what's not right for you but it's putting yourself in a vulnerable place
41:44
where you might look stupid yeah where you might not know everything and you
41:50
might have to admit to somebody tell me more about this definitely um definitely
41:55
all the time oh my God I'm not sure am I
42:00
you know but but what's that that's just life and it's not like who really cares you know if you look foolish or you
42:07
didn't then somebody can help you and they feel good about oh I know how to help this person or you know it's not so
42:12
bad it is a gift yeah maybe it's it is a gift to somebody to allow them
42:19
to help you along exactly you know what I mean we don't always have to be the one
42:24
who is in the know or how I mean there's no there's no reciprocal part of the
42:31
relationship then if it's all what somebody's doing for you exactly that's a great point isn't it it's like that's
42:38
how we manage in life you know and then we help each other and we just I don't know I guess I guess
42:45
I've just looked stupid and not known what I was doing for so long I just doesn't doesn't bother me that much
42:52
so you've given up caring about it or have you never really cared about that whole feeling of how somebody would
42:59
judge or interpret it I think when I was a kid in school and I'd raise my hand when I wasn't like staring out the
43:04
window like daydreaming and drawing all my stuff and I get it wrong I would just like oh and never want to do that again
43:11
I don't want to raise my hand I really wasn't paying attention I don't know what I'm saying so I did for a long time
43:16
like kind of not you know reveal that I was didn't have a didn't really know but somewhere along
43:24
the line that kind of stuff will stop you from doing something that you want to try so
43:30
it totally does might as well just try it you know and just it feels sometimes you
43:36
do feel stupid but then there's a bravery to that or an honesty to that and then like you say people will come
43:41
you can ask for help you can screw up you can ruin five paintings whatever you
43:49
know you take on commissions you're like oh yeah I can do that and then it's like this gut wrenching hard process
43:54
sometimes you know trying to think through someone else's brain and then you just say all right I don't I'm not
44:00
doing commissions like that anymore I have a whole way I do it I'm gonna do what I want to make if you liked it
44:06
great see I just have to learn I we said yes to a project years ago
44:14
and it was completely out of our comfort zone it went from creating a single
44:19
piece that you know you could hold in your hands and have it be like on a table or mantle to being something that
44:26
was hundreds of pieces being assembled and hanging from the ceiling and so I
44:32
worked with people who knew what they were doing and like Architects and designers and they gave me all the specs
44:39
and all this but when it came to the assembling of the piece I still felt like we needed to participate in the
44:48
positioning the glass on the structure the way we wanted it to so we thought we
44:53
had worked out all the bugs we'd gotten like 75 of the money for this massive project
44:59
we show up they have the the scaffolds in the air but the structures were
45:06
touching the scaffolds and there was no other positioning that the scaffolds
45:11
could be placed huh so we're in a position where we can't hang the glass
45:17
because you can't have metal scaffolds leading up against it
45:23
so I had that moment in time where I thought to myself we have said yes to
45:29
something that we are not going to be able to do and it was the scariest
45:34
feeling I have ever had ever yes I hate that feeling but but it worked out it
45:40
worked out I thought it worked out people who who were in The know who knew what to do jumped in came up with an
45:48
alternative it wasn't easy and I tell you we felt so proud of ourselves to have solved that puzzle and it made us
45:54
hungry to solve other puzzles just like that that is you know what I mean Greatest Story exactly because now your
46:00
brain says oh it didn't stop the the solve came and
46:06
now you know the song almost always the solve comes that's that's like this Faith or
46:13
something it's like okay it's gonna work out maybe not the way I pictured it maybe you know I need 12 people to help
46:19
but it that that's the faith of being an artist I think is that it always somehow
46:26
works out like how did we make a living all those years I don't even know but somehow some crazy person would buy you
46:34
know some big piece on here's a check in the mail from the guy that's like oh my God how do we keep getting away with
46:39
this stuff you know and then you start to trust yeah it keeps working yeah that's that moment of never saying quit
46:46
showing up and then never saying quit exactly so and those decisions and those
46:52
experiences inform future decisions because now you have the knowledge and
46:59
you can trust that somehow it will get worked out see that's the thing like you
47:05
can always pull back and say oh man I I don't know you know and then some great
47:10
thing will come I mean it happens over and over and over doesn't it in life yeah yeah so that's it how did that
47:19
concept even start to to to come into Focus for you I mean was this something
47:25
that you have had your whole life or is it something that was there a particular
47:30
defining point where that was a realization that that was big for you I
47:35
think it was in our early days of being artists dry I drove this
47:41
ugliest black truck you ever saw it had hail damage and rust and I could see the ground under my feet I mean it was
47:47
horrible and we we literally did eat like beans and ramen and all the stuff
47:53
but we were so excited about what we were doing it just all seemed fine you know but we would yeah we would have
48:00
these moments like I don't know how we're gonna we just paid for a bunch of
48:05
shows and I don't know how we're gonna pay the electric you know we were uh scared and then
48:12
something would happen like the check in the mail or some wonderful person would come along and say do you still have
48:18
that painting and it would work out yeah so then we started paying attention I was like honey let's look okay right now
48:25
I don't know how this is gonna work but let's remind ourselves when the weird thing just happens and it works
48:31
let's pay attention to it and let's like write it down let's like make a list like because I have no clue how we're
48:37
gonna pull this off and then it when it would work out we would talk about it can you believe that
48:42
that just happened like oh my God we are so lucky it's like a miracle you know what I like what you're describing
48:48
though it is almost like a scientist's brain where you're like okay this
48:53
happened and we're gonna be in this position again let's create the structure
48:58
so that when we're in this position again that we we have tools lined up to
49:04
keep us on track yeah to remind us that oh my God but then it became this really
49:10
fun game it's like okay let's let's just let this roll out and see how it's gonna
49:15
work out and then we would just be kind of on the lookout for these crazy little wonderful Kismet things that we all you
49:22
know all artists have it or some you know yeah Chuck breaks down and someone's selling a thing or you know
49:28
all that cool stuff that just just works out so the stories yeah
49:34
we all have from being on the road well back to kind of like this nurturing of
49:40
kind of like the the goal is creating a creative space to create the work which the work ends
49:48
up being the revenue source for us so it's this complicated mess of things so
49:55
it sounds like you mechanically create structure around putting yourself in an
50:01
environment that makes you stress-free or makes you happy makes you feel
50:07
creative can you talk a little bit about your routine or your structure and how that works with create creating stuff
50:13
you know there's a there's so many funny things I've learned over the years one of the things was deadlines for us
50:19
deadlines were always happening because there's a show deadline and there's all this stuff but our Gallery but the
50:25
deadline forced us to push through and find the solutions you know finish the
50:31
body of work and get it so we always have had deadlines I think so yeah but
50:37
the other piece of that is making it um I'm looking at my little
50:43
art fort out here it's so enjoyable like I have every Art Supply that I'm
50:52
interested in I get like right now I'm painting with these big fat oil sticks and they're just creamy and buttery and
50:58
I get excited about it I I just get them and play with them and you know I just I
51:04
don't I don't know I think the setting yourself up to play giving yourself the time and the space to just like okay I'm
51:11
going in there I have no clue what I'm gonna do even though I need to finish three paintings and I got a commission but I'm
51:17
not thinking of it that way I'm thinking I'm just going to make see what happens and then off I go and then I start to
51:23
solve it I don't know if that makes sense but it has to be a pleasure for your brain you know let me see if I
51:30
understand correctly that so you obviously have work that you have
51:36
committed to a collector or a gallery or a show and those are things that all of
51:43
us can find that when we have to actually step up and start working on it even if
51:50
it's something we do regularly and routinely it's when there's that outcome that we've committed to it kind of gets
51:57
in the way of us being able to do it freely and joyfully but it sounds like you start with like a
52:05
freeing kind of entry point like you will create work that is not within a
52:11
desired outcome and then when that starts rolling you can kind of shift gears into the other thing is that is
52:16
that what you were saying that's kind of it it's like that's how I know how to prime the pump that's how I know to get
52:22
myself in there and move in my hands and then all the stuff starts to work that's I just set myself up to play
52:30
knowing that once I get sort of engaged and excited and off I go then it all
52:36
works but you know that that little inertia you know to get back in there after
52:41
you've been off to a show and have fun and blah blah you come back you're like oh now I gotta get back in there or if
52:47
you set yourself up or you work on in my case I can work on three paintings at a time you know and I just get started and
52:53
I layer and I you know I just know how to make my brain find it fun so I try
53:00
and do it that way and then once you're engaged you know once you really are into it hours and hours go by and off
53:07
you go like you're just something works out because for people who get kind of
53:12
stuck where they just can't get the motivation it kind of seems like if you
53:19
physically just start moving the pain around or you know messing with some
53:25
molten glass and not care what it turns into that that can kind of get you out
53:30
of your own way that's that's for me that's everything for John too like if
53:36
it's playful and oh my God this cool thing he's making sculpture right now
53:41
for a jazz fest and he's like having okay best time like he's just having a ball like oh my God this weird
53:48
thing this head I made for that fit on this better and can you believe this nail was like the perfect old weird nail
53:53
it just you know these little Kismet things if it's that's all it is it's like one big set of kismet play if you
54:01
set yourself up for it yeah um I come from I wouldn't say my immediate family but an extended family
54:07
of kind of cynics and when we talk about stuff like meant to be or Kismet or getting really
54:15
enthused about if the nail fits in perfectly into the sculpture they kind
54:20
of look at this kind of person and be like something's weird about that dude
54:26
or there's something inauthentic about it it's it's like there's some strange still I mean is this something you have
54:33
ever experienced or familiar with this kind of concept yeah I'm familiar and I just I just think there's different
54:40
brains you know there's The Logical great people and they hang with the logical great people and someone like me
54:46
comes along maybe they go that's nuts but they can see that you're having fun and they respond to that or they don't
54:52
that's fine or you know you get your people you don't when I teach you know I teach workshops yeah there's so much of
54:59
that that happens in the world like they come in and everyone's got that story you know we all have it where someone
55:06
made fun of them or someone put them down or an art teacher said that's not how you do it stop it or you can't sing
55:11
your voice is bad blah blah blah we all get this outside critic and then we turn
55:17
it as an inside critic you know I'm not good at this I'm not an artist I can't draw how many of us have that story
55:23
right and it turns into these self-limiting beliefs like that it'll shape people's lives for years before
55:30
they can like come to terms with that and they don't allow themselves to create so I just try and make a space
55:36
when I teach so it's like creating is what we're set up for like this is why
55:41
we're here like it's supposed to be you know you're making a beautiful meal or you're raising a child or you're
55:46
building all that stuff is creativity in my brain so let's just play don't cut
55:52
yourself off from that that's like who you are like you can paint that Sky orange or blue or I don't care green
55:59
doesn't matter let's just do it and then they get this oh I can just do it and then you're like yeah this is supposed
56:05
to be playful you know then you can tighten it up at the end and all that crap if you want but
56:11
Just Keep It Wide Open just be be like a kid so like living creatively and living
56:17
freely as as a creative type person making work like this does that
56:23
inherently make us an artist or does being an artist involve that next step
56:28
of the commentary or or having it have to mean something or have a message can
56:34
we be artists who create things with like extreme craftsmanship and Joy or
56:41
whatever you know what I mean by that yeah I think so and I think everyone's different you know somebody's going to
56:47
get great satisfaction out of the most fantastically the realistic painting
56:52
that is just Exquisite mouth-wateringly perfect you know it depends on who you
56:58
are of course but I think there's a great joy and freedom just by creating I
57:05
think we should allow ourselves that and then the rest is the rest you know if it sells if you make a career of it doesn't
57:11
matter but you should let yourself write Let Yourself Play Let Yourself paint the
57:17
fence I just painted our fence orange and red big Stripes you know I don't care if my neighbor thinks it's crazy
57:23
yeah it's okay you know I love it so just let yourself do it it speaks more
57:29
to an internal kind of quality of life internally driven than having to define
57:36
something from an external place of what you know what maybe an intellectual brain would put towards exactly you know
57:43
what I mean like they might say have to describe it or Define it Define it right
57:48
and that so much with art I found is you can have a big idea and people they
57:54
bring to the work what they bring to the work so I don't even try and explain it
57:59
anymore I mean some of my stuff is real funny the old mixed media I love doing that it doesn't really matter you know what I
58:06
guess it does it doesn't I don't know I just I think it's important just to create and then it people respond how
58:13
they respond you know I just have found that my collectors have
58:19
some kind of response to the playfulness some kind of like they just are like my
58:26
people it's not everybody but they get it they they're always kind of excited like what the hell is she gonna do this
58:32
time like I'm the first person at her Booth because who knows what the heck she's going to come up with because I'm not that predictable you know I just
58:40
show up well I resonate with with what you're describing because I feel like sometimes
58:46
Renee and I when we're talking about our work we feel like there's an energy behind it that is unspoken and is more
58:54
than just Visual and there is an attraction to certain collectors that
58:59
they just walk up and they say I get it makes me happy and for us that makes us
59:06
happy to know that somebody else kind of gets the intention that's it for me
59:11
that's it it's like you'll find your people you know and they respond to your
59:16
your intellect they can respond to whatever it is that you're serving up you know and so my people respond to
59:22
this weird joyful let's try it Vibe you know but I have to say I also am so
59:30
committed in my brain like this is a real important thing in my life this is a real practice that I continue we try to
59:37
learn and try and grow and make mistakes so I can expand it you know so I'm not just like willy-nilly
59:44
throwing crap out there I mean I have to dial it in I have to finish it I have to
59:50
feel it looks you know the way I want it to look in the end but there's a lot of that play in there that resonates it's
59:56
still you know obvious I got that balance because the the Seesaw can tip
1:00:02
too far to One Direction where it's all about the outcome and then the work
1:00:08
suffers yeah or you get bored like I don't know if it works for people but I
1:00:14
don't want to be bored like I don't I actually really want to think of it as work it's got to be like really tickling
1:00:21
my brain I gotta have little surprises going on I gotta feed my weird brain
1:00:26
that's that's just you know I love color I love color against color like if I can
1:00:31
set myself up for oh my God that's freaking awesome you know that you could find another shade of orange yes your
1:00:38
life would be amazing right I love Orange it's the truth and it just
1:00:43
I was thinking about this the other day because I have so much color and I'm looking out my backyard there's color
1:00:48
there's big striped balls that are lanterny things there's just color and I
1:00:53
thought I wonder if my cones or whatever in my eyeballs like just have some extra
1:00:59
weird thing about them because I am like delighted by color all day
1:01:06
every day like I seek it out and then I've been doing all this Lighting in our
1:01:11
backyard for you know in the trees and the thing and I just look at the way the lights hitting that leaf look at the way
1:01:17
the lights hitting that color look at the change of it just sends my brain into I just love it so maybe my eyes are
1:01:26
different or something leave that no I I am feeling 100 here we've Renee and I
1:01:31
have had people like get this Museum where we did the um installation for were they did they write about us as
1:01:38
being coloristas and so there is something about that about color
1:01:45
and you and I don't have words for it right now but we're looking at each other and we're getting each other
1:01:52
isn't it joyful and isn't it like part of the reason that you love what you do is because of this weird
1:01:59
thing that's happening with the color and it's just so joyful and I worry about the folks who don't have it
1:02:07
I think oh my God they're just missing did they and I'm always saying oh my God look at the light
1:02:13
people are like oh whatever with the light but I just it just zings my brain
1:02:18
whatever that is I gotta tell you a few years ago we had a designer come in our booth and saying the new color on the
1:02:26
scene and I was getting really excited to hear about this she says is gray oh
1:02:33
great I will follow me everyone full disclosure we're using gray in our work
1:02:39
but I'm it's it's not joyful isn't that funny and it's everywhere
1:02:46
like our house is so nice but uh but but the power of a gray or the power of a
1:02:53
neutral Is So Exciting in painting because it makes the other guys sing so
1:02:59
it's like oh I literally I love myself a good gray like a warm gray and cooler I'm all about that but but yeah it's
1:03:05
just to live with gray I don't oh I don't think so read this gray that but
1:03:10
then you know they have our Pops of color on their walls then uh life is good and life is good that's good that's
1:03:16
why Art's so important yeah so you've talked about creating a that
1:03:23
when people feel stuck or when people are are are challenged with you know
1:03:29
getting inspired that another component to creating that space is actually being
1:03:34
in a physical space with physical people around you who share that kind of
1:03:41
like-mindedness because that's where Sparks start to fly I I find that kovid
1:03:47
really sent us off to our our our little homes and things really went to online
1:03:54
we started to look online at each other and communicating online and it's such a
1:04:01
virtual space that that physical space needs to kind of come back if we if we
1:04:07
don't want to stay stagnant I agree with that that's why when we first got to go back to shows like yeah
1:04:14
it was so exciting and the the collectors were like on fire and the
1:04:20
artists were so happy to see each other like that is a component and I do think
1:04:25
if I was to give somebody advice which you know I always say I'm not a I'm not good at
1:04:32
anything like I'm just you know Forrest gumping my way along but For Young Artists honestly I I don't think of
1:04:39
myself as an authority at all I'm just doing my little way but but you're sharing your experiences which I think
1:04:46
that is that's what we need to do in life is just to share share yeah I think
1:04:52
so too but certainly my way is not the right way or the oh you know the only way there's I don't have that I don't like that actually yeah I don't like the
1:04:59
onus of thinking I know what I'm doing but I do think because our family John's
1:05:05
family and we have had this shared warehouse space with 23 artists right now and we've had it for Going on 30
1:05:11
years his heart his mom of course is an artist so I think uh when I meet these
1:05:17
great young artists and I say well if you're moving you know they're maybe to a new place I'm like search out
1:05:22
something like that because you might really gain so much from being in a
1:05:28
shared work environment artist environment because you support each other's shows and work and you learn like when I get stuck when I work
1:05:34
downtown I have a building in the back of our house but then we have the downtown Studio you can just poke around
1:05:41
the studio and see everybody doing all these wonderful different things and your brain just gets you know inspired
1:05:48
again if you get started you know okay is that a space you used to work in
1:05:54
and then you kind of can float back and forth or is is the you call it the art
1:05:59
Fort yeah the forest is the art fort out your back out your back window there is
1:06:04
that where you are primarily creating your work yeah I I like the art Fort best because we have a dog and I love
1:06:11
the dog and it's right on the water it's this funny little building that's just fun and it's all colorful of course
1:06:18
um and I like to be outside that's my nature so I pull my big tannings outside I have easels out there I work on I have
1:06:25
it all set up I mean I can make really big artwork in this tiny space or
1:06:31
downtown it's called McRae art studios where there's 24 of us and it's a
1:06:36
beautiful space for workshops and it's a big building it's air-conditioned it's all the nice stuff you know nicer than
1:06:42
our old buildings then I can work there and I also made recently this big
1:06:47
storage place to put storage behind so I just have all big walls and I can really go
1:06:53
to town on big stuff or big paper so I've got uh room to experiment uh on
1:07:01
super big stuff down there and then I've got my everyday I have a whole set of
1:07:06
all my oil paints at both places it's kind of crazy but I can you know I've
1:07:12
got both places I can just dip right in cool it serves different purposes different functions and the community is
1:07:20
so wonderful okay and now the classes that you teach
1:07:25
and the workshops that you do I happen to see a few clips of those they seem pretty like well produced and stuff they
1:07:33
seem like a top-notch type type situation can you talk about that and tell us how that came about yeah that
1:07:40
was um I met this wonderful artist her name's Carlos on Heim and I was teaching
1:07:45
a workshop out west which is where she lives and she was in my class and she was in the back of the class and she was
1:07:53
really quiet and just cool you know Vibe and I would look over her shoulder and go oh my God I love what she's doing
1:08:00
like she's just doing her this whole she has just a wonderful Charming interesting way so that's when we first
1:08:05
met and then somewhere along the line she and her husband who is brilliant his
1:08:10
name is Steve Sondheim and he's a photographer and all this stuff he had the skills to sort of start filming her
1:08:17
and he would just film her hands and then she would speak and she was a little camera shy in the beginning and
1:08:23
so they just built this online business way before anyone else was doing it I
1:08:29
mean okay she was and so they slowly built an online sort of a university and
1:08:34
she they would hand pick artists that they felt sort of reflected their whatever
1:08:40
and so they're very Integrity filled they're very smart they're just brilliant and so like I said the first
1:08:47
time would you be interested in filming and I was like I don't know what how to do it but sure let's try it and they
1:08:54
flew in you set up the cameras yeah I said yes and they should and I said okay I'm just gonna make this thing and I'll
1:09:00
talk through it and that's what we did and he you know the production value is all the two of them are really smart and
1:09:07
he's got three cameras and the right lighting and it's you know super well edited and they just have a high quality
1:09:15
there's just a great they're just a great couple yeah so I got to hook up with them
1:09:21
pretty early on you know and is that a regular thing that you film classes with
1:09:27
them or is that something that was kind of done like you did it and it's it's archived or whatever so it's archived so
1:09:33
most all of my classes are now available as self-study so people buy them they
1:09:39
have them all for forever um same with all the the teachers there Carla you know included so it goes both
1:09:47
ways but you also teach a live class like it's a new class and everyone takes it together and this whole online
1:09:52
community it's so well done and I just got lucky to you know hook up with people who are really top-notch so but
1:10:00
um we were doing about I was doing about two classes every year spring and fall and then did a couple year-long classes
1:10:07
together you know that we just did different stuff they're always like stretching and growing and they've built
1:10:14
a really great business you know they're they're they're smart when you say classes is it like if if you did like
1:10:19
spring and Fall Would it be like multiple segments to a bigger package
1:10:25
yeah the way it worked for us is that I would come up with an idea for a class
1:10:31
and we would break it down into say six lessons or ten lessons and then it got
1:10:37
to where I would go out and film there because they have this whole studio set up and we would talk it through and you
1:10:43
know they're really good at you know they have great information and then you'd break it down into lessons and
1:10:48
you'd film each lesson and then you package that and you buy that class so gosh I have so many I have quite a few
1:10:56
big ball blooms was the Super popular one with the big messy flower paintings you know that was a big one but the
1:11:04
essence of still life all these funny little overlapping cloudy strange still lives and gosh I did a lot of the art of
1:11:11
noticing kind of a sketchbooky thing and so yeah but since covet happened I
1:11:18
wasn't flying out there because you know that didn't seem now they're getting like these super well-known Heinrich
1:11:23
dresser this is wonderful you know illustrator who I love like they're just getting
1:11:28
anyone they would ask would want to do it with them I mean they really got a
1:11:34
cool stable of teachers so but I haven't awesome yeah it's
1:11:40
awesome it really is I mean I I recommend all of her classes they're just they're all of her teachers are
1:11:46
really great I have to say really great individuals this grew out of a physical class that you were physically in person
1:11:52
teaching and she was a student in the class have you had any other experiences like that where opportunity is kind of
1:11:59
sprung from the teaching uh yeah I think so like people would
1:12:05
take the Workshops the in-person workshops too or people would take the
1:12:10
online workshops and then one of the gals is like oh I do a series of workshops in Mexico and all over the
1:12:16
different places in the world and I want you to come teach with us and it's a culinary tour as well as a you know that
1:12:23
kind of thing would just spring out of people taking your class or becoming aware of you
1:12:29
it's just all that crazy it just kept unfolding and I said yeah okay yeah let's try let's just see what happened
1:12:37
yeah but one thing that happened a long time ago I was doing St Louis Art Festival and there's a woman named Mary
1:12:43
inglebright she's like um illustrator type but she had a magazine and it was
1:12:50
called Home Companion which sounds very sweet but it's also very focused on
1:12:55
artists and so they came in my booth at St Louis and it was Mary and her editor
1:13:01
and they said we'd like to do an article on you we'll come to your studio and you
1:13:08
know photograph it and all that stuff and I was like great let's do it I've never had that before and they did
1:13:15
and it just went out you know and then all these other people like oh I want you to be in my magazine I want you to
1:13:21
be can you do this can you it just happened because I said yes to Mary and
1:13:26
it was a great experience so you never know right well what are you working on
1:13:31
now any big projects along the way or or you know tell me about that let's see
1:13:37
just today uh we just loaded the van with six paintings that I'm taking to a
1:13:43
gallery close by Gallery zero so that's fun we got that all ready to go you know
1:13:50
big ones like 46 by 48 by 60 and so that's so that'll be delivered today and
1:13:57
then what else are we doing okay John's getting ready for jazz fest and then since I'm not in it I get to like roam
1:14:03
around and eat drink and watch all the music and have fun well we'll be there too for the first time ever
1:14:10
oh Mike you are going to love it I am so
1:14:15
excited but the reputation does precede itself I mean there's a little bit of like the newness makes me like kind of
1:14:22
feel like I'm getting choked off a little bit but I'm trying just to take any present and just put myself there
1:14:29
and just let everything unfold and enjoy everything along the way oh I really
1:14:34
think you're gonna love it it's a different breed like everyone that's there almost it seems has been there
1:14:40
year after year they once they go it's so exciting and they are free to spend we're like the artist the main event you
1:14:48
know is the music and then the food and then the art but while they're scrolling around walking around between the uh all
1:14:54
the music and the goodness there's art I would tell you one thing that we learned I don't know if you probably already know this or how your stuff goes but
1:15:01
because they're in such vacation mode and um we always try and build the
1:15:06
shipping into the price so we can offer free shipping because it's one less they're not gonna take the piece and
1:15:12
carry it around you know the the whole festival sure yeah and that way you just
1:15:17
go free shipping that's the thing I was stressing about was how to handle because I want to capture that
1:15:25
enthusiasm for the work and I don't want them to think about it and think they're going to come back to us like when they
1:15:31
get back from their trip and it's two weeks later I want to capture them get
1:15:36
the whole shipping thing down smooth and they can be on their way and I can
1:15:43
pack everything back in the van and send it to them so that's that's that's the thing with the puzzle we're trying to solve right now good that helps a ton
1:15:50
and you can even put a little sign free shipping so they just know they can enjoy it oh we'll take that and then
1:15:55
they don't have to worry about it shows up at their house when they get back yeah cool I'm looking forward to seeing you guys there
1:16:01
to wrap up here you and John have a very well respected presence out here on the
1:16:08
road I mean a lot of people know the Ripples and
1:16:14
I had an opportunity to talk with some of your dear friends who are involved in
1:16:20
seesaw and you know we are just getting to know each other and my question to
1:16:26
them was is there anything I should know about Lynn going into this conversation
1:16:32
that might make for a good topic and they said Lynn presents to the world and all of her professional ways is who Lynn
1:16:40
genuinely is in private that that is that you are who
1:16:45
you are and I am so inspired by not only you putting your creativity out in the
1:16:52
world for people to Love and Enjoy but fostering and encouraging other people to do the same and making a space for
1:16:59
them so that your light your joy is like a ripple effect and I want to thank you
1:17:05
for that getting to know you and getting to know about your story yeah make me cry that's the nicest thing
1:17:11
thank you so much well I have been struggling I've talked about
1:17:16
this on the podcast dealing with this physical issue my work has felt like
1:17:22
work and I put your podcast episode on um I'll put it in the episode notes to
1:17:29
give her episode a shout out that you did earlier this month uh what was that who was what was that episode Kate
1:17:36
Shepherd and it's called creative genius I was doing the most mundane thing in
1:17:41
the basement organizing and getting stuff ready with packing materials and I found my mood shifting and I
1:17:49
felt so much lighter and the work that we've been making the last few days is
1:17:56
making me happy and happy to put it out there so I want you to know
1:18:02
that this this has really meant a lot to me thank you oh my gosh I can't even
1:18:08
imagine that that is the case thank you so much for saying that that really
1:18:13
means a lot to me that's just a heartwarming what a nice gift to say that thank you
1:18:28
well I thank you so much for being on the show today and I we are gonna have a
1:18:34
good time in New Orleans here next week and so thanks for sitting down with me we are this has been an absolute Joy
1:18:40
thank you you're just brilliant at what you know what you're smart and fun and fun and I relate so much to all of
1:18:49
our struggles together that you guys are sharing and do you like oysters
1:18:54
I don't know and I'm gonna have to say yes because I've never tried them
1:19:01
okay this is gonna have to go on your on your gonna have to try them on my yes list
1:19:06
they're so good like that is like well we're gonna leave in the morning and just drive us straight through so we can
1:19:12
eat oysters at Felix's that night like we love oysters and they have the best
1:19:18
oysters in New Orleans so that's your recommendation is to try those while we're there
1:19:23
oh gosh yes and if you're a little nervous about the raw they have a broiled one that is just okay flipping
1:19:28
awesome the food is not interest with when it comes to food believe me I might try just about anything
1:19:35
you're gonna be happy in New Orleans because their food is you can't get bad food there it's all good it's all good
1:19:42
delicious all right thanks so much Lynn this has been a blast I really appreciate you and a pleasure I
1:19:49
appreciate you too thanks Douglas okay bye-bye bye-bye well Douglas here I am
1:19:55
at the end of your conversation with Lynn Whipple uh expected to comment on something that I haven't heard yet great
1:20:01
talk with Lynn man how inspiring was that yes she's had these opportunities come to her from first of all being an
1:20:08
artist then someone approached her and said hey you should teach a class and the class happens and then this TV
1:20:15
production of teaching a class comes up so anyway the whole thing I'm trying to get to is she does not want to claim to
1:20:20
be an expert on anything that doesn't make her comfortable she just is sharing her experiences for her personally and
1:20:27
if it resonates with somebody else that's awesome but she does not want to be like this is the way for everybody
1:20:33
else I mean she's an expert on Lynn you know and that's inspiring so lean into that so uh the fact that people respond
1:20:41
to her she's an expert on herself so just be that she's an amazing artist and
1:20:46
an amazing human so and knowing yourself and knowing what works for you some people have trouble defining all that
1:20:53
stuff it takes sometimes you know when you come from a tribe of people who are
1:20:59
different if when you're the alien in the tribe it takes a while to shake off all that baggage before you kind of know
1:21:05
who you are individually lint kind of came out of the gate fully formed in that respect she she had this nurturing
1:21:10
tribe of people that were all artists and that just kind of that's that's what produces yeah so I reject that Lynn I
1:21:16
reject you saying that you're not an expert all you have to do is be an expert on yourself and we're just gonna uh take take a little uh piece of that
1:21:23
this week you know I really was genuine when I I wanted to thank her for what
1:21:29
she did for me this week but also you know the ripple effect that her
1:21:35
brightness has on the artist's Community getting ready for this interview I
1:21:41
wanted to re-watch her video that was shown on seesaw last year that was a
1:21:46
project on YouTube that Kina Crow Chris dalquist and Beth bojorski put on that
1:21:51
was a really in entertaining those videos are still up they interviewed some of our favorite folks and there's
1:21:57
some really entertaining talks that are on there well they really showcased artists while we were all in lockdown
1:22:02
are for each other and also for collectors so that they could you know kind of see behind the scenes and see in
1:22:09
people's Studios which are still live you can you can look up seesaw on YouTube and watch their whole series but
1:22:16
anyway I watched the segment with Lynn Whipple and at the end of it Keena
1:22:21
shared a very touching moment she shared that when she wanted to get into the art
1:22:28
show world and transition out of working in TV she was working at Nickelodeon and somebody said you know what you should
1:22:34
reach out to a friend of mine Lynn Whipple and you should ask her for advice Kina reached out to her shared
1:22:41
some of her work and Lynn Whipple they didn't know each other at the time this was back in 2000 or whatever Lynn
1:22:47
responded with this encouragement and this this encouragement is what
1:22:55
propelled Kino forward into her career and look at kina's impact on the world with her work so it's really a ripple
1:23:02
effect of what we do as artists and how we impact others and the creativity that
1:23:08
builds and builds and builds from there and I just think that's such an awesome awesome way to be it is an awesome way
1:23:13
to be and I appreciate you interviewing uh I don't know such inspiring kind of folks it's it's been um it's one of you
1:23:20
you needed a little pick me up so you interviewed Lynn I need a little bit of comfort so I leaned and been it it's
1:23:26
it's nice that we have this community that we can kind of get that kind of comfort and support from so yeah good
1:23:33
times I didn't think we were going to have a podcast here this week Douglas so nice work yeah and I hope you have a
1:23:38
really good trip you've got some really fun things planned between shows and hey I'll check in with you when you get back
1:23:44
absolutely we have some exciting interviews coming up uh Annie bassone promises that she's going to eventually
1:23:50
talk to me so folks that have been asking for fiber artists I promise we're not just kicking the can down she's
1:23:56
kicking my ass with this thing get on the interview it'll be lady we gotta talk well she's a busy lady I mean I
1:24:02
understand this is not an easy thing to make time for but when she does have the time I for one am gonna be so excited to
1:24:10
hear it's high energy she's good people and if we if we talk about it here Douglas maybe we'll put her on the spot
1:24:15
get her to come home oh no she's going to be like oh damn I'm down in anchor I gotta show up
1:24:21
absolutely all right we'll get to it she is very busy we all are all right Douglas thanks again for uh doing this
1:24:26
with me it's been a been a good week and in spite of all the challenges and and we'll see you next time really
1:24:32
appreciate you man thanks for all your work this podcast is brought to you by the
1:24:37
National Association of Independent Artists the website is naiaartists.org also sponsored by
1:24:44
zapplication that's zapplication.org and while you're at it check out Will's website at
1:24:51
willarmstrongart.com and my website at cigarithglass.com be sure to subscribe
1:24:56
to this podcast and be notified when we release new episodes
1:25:03
foreign